I've not found any ARM will beat a late model Intel yet, but there is no reason why ultimately it shouldn't. After all most CISC processors are RISC processors with microcode.
But the point here is that Apple didn't 'design' the chip any more than it designed the 6502, 6800, power PC or Intel chips.
Indeed, my phone and (not that I have one) Raspberry Pis, and also GPUs are very power efficient but they lack the number of programs they can run.
I have Zen2 (an AMD Ryzen 9 3900XT) and that's also TSMC, but 7nm.
The equivalent CPU on Zen3 (Ryzen 9 5900X) is also 7nm.
Yes, very fast.
So the high speed is just magic then?
On a sunny day (Sun, 17 Apr 2022 13:56:39 +0100) it happened "Commander Kinsey" snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@ryzen.lan:
Not so sure, maybe a few MS windows program but the open source Unix / Linux world has likely an often better version, free at that, and a lot more choice.
Most people have trouble using Windows, nevermind Linux.
Anyway, I run a lot of science research programs (see Boinc) and I think out of about 40 projects, only 5 run on ARM. They just don't see the point in recoding everything.
Come now, risc processors have been used for three decades now, the compiler guys are really really good at generating quality code for all of them.
As for the "more ram" for code, that's not necessarily true either, as all risc instructions are fixed (2 or 4 bytes depending) while the intel instructions can be much longer than 4 bytes; plus the variable length instructions on x86 complicate instruction decoding and make out-of-order execution more complicated.
Fact is that the Apple Aarch64 processor is better than the intel processors in almost every way, including performance per watt.
Possibly true, but totally irrelevant. Most people can't do differential calculus either.
You are one of the volunteers who runs other peoples programs on your computer. The people who write the programs write them to run on the most popular hardware, rather than the most powerful hardware, because there's more of the popular hardware around.
I've got a Windows partition on my computer which gets much more heavily used than the Linux partition - hardly anybody I know uses Linux, and what we swap around is what everybody can use.
For years I had the gEDA circuit design program running on my Linux partition, but then KiCAD came out, which also runs under Windows. I haven't done much with either program, but it was comforting to have them there against the possibility that an interesting problem might crop up.
No modern programmer is good at anything, especially tight coding. Give them a computer from the 80s and they'd have trouble writing a calculator program to fit into 64KB.
I had a '73 but after I piled it up one foggy morning I switched to Camaros and Firebirds. The 2nd generation of Mustangs were Pintos with lipstick. It took Ford a long time to get back to a real car.
I've got a 5500U in my laptop. It's a 7nm Zen2 unlike the 5600U Zen3 but I have no complaints for a $700 laptop.
On a sunny day (Sun, 17 Apr 2022 15:31:56 +0100) it happened "Commander Kinsey" snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@ryzen.lan:
Well, I have written loads of programs for x86 in C for Unix / Linux Ported all I use to Raspberries.. The breaking point is sometimes the libraries, I try to avoid linking in libraries anyways if possible, I had to port some existing ones and change those. So its work, but everything I normally use now also runs on raspis. My PC is off these days, 5 raspberries in the room, 3 on 24/7, 1 on all day as router, and 1 for experiments. Only time PC is on is for adjusting satellite dish and HAM radio QO100 stuff that software has already been recompiled on the raspi, needs a new USB DVB-S2 tuner compatible with the Linux kernel. Low priority. Surviving WW3 comes first ? Anyways one big EMP and all those cellphones and puters and electric power are no more. Then you need an abacus :-)
On a sunny day (Sun, 17 Apr 2022 16:46:46 +0100) it happened "Commander Kinsey" snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@ryzen.lan:
What's a modern programmer? One that uses that snake language 'python' or so? I like to code in asm for Microchip PIC micros, there is a lot you can do with 256 bytes RAM and 16 kB ROM.
So if he makes an Intel chip based on ideas in Apple, how do they prove it? It's like saying that song sounds a bit like that one.
That's 0.4 of the speed of my desktop. Laptops suck.
How much work is it? And can everything be ported? You could do a lot of good on the boinc projects.
Some people backup to optical just in case.
You sound like a real programmer. As it happens I'm having a lot of problems with Python. Some idiot managed to make the program require AVX, when 50% of the users had CPUs predating that.
On a sunny day (Sun, 17 Apr 2022 17:55:45 +0100) it happened "Commander Kinsey" snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@ryzen.lan:
Depends, I had problems with libforms, they dropped right and middle mouse, contacted the developer but used an old version and recompiled that on raspi, renamed it libzorms.... (to avoid conflict with any newer version) works.. The gcc compiler is very very good, so its not that hard, it is more getting used to things. Much has been ported to ARM / raspi for Debian, often all it needs is 'apt-get install library-name'
On a sunny day (Sun, 17 Apr 2022 17:56:59 +0100) it happened "Commander Kinsey" snipped-for-privacy@nospam.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@ryzen.lan:
I have never written anything in Python, and have no intention to learn it. C is <in my view> much simpler.
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