OT: Rant on Dictatorship

Yep, you are having a really bad day.BTDT, get out of the US, it's a failed state/system :(

martin

This country is moving moer and more into a dictatorship. Probably started when FDR stole (almost) all of the gold from us. The so-called Patriot Act does not help, and then there is the so-called Homeland Security. And now we have to deal with the stealing of Analog TVs! One of the bullshit lies is that bandwidth will be saved. To digitize an analog audio waveform (20Hz-20KHz) reasonably well into the digital domain requires a sampling rate in excess of 60Khz. A 40Khz sampling rate may capture a 20Khz sine, but the phase info is totally lost and the amplitude can be lost also (eg: sampling happens at zero crossover). So, digital data has a higher bandwidth for the same info, and worse, in TV we have this "promise" of high definition which by definition means even *more* data bandwidth. All of this MANDATED conversion is not to benefit the public per se, but to line the pockets of various electronic manufactuers (who lobbied at great $$ for this BS). Did the public have any say? Sure not like the conversion from B&W to color where at least three options were made available *and* forward/backward compatibility built into (some of) the schemes. And WTF can we do to stop the MANDATE and at worst make it *optional*?

You're forgetting about compression. Video compresses.

All this started somewhere around 1982-3-4(?), in Congress, IIRC. Public comment and outcry from competing factions is what delayed it 'til now.

No worries--the government will pay you to make sure you can still watch TV. $40 coupons for converter boxes, from somewhere on the web. As if people needed subsidies to watch more TV.

Cheers, James Arthur

"Cures were developed for which there were no known diseases." -- Ronald Reagan, commenting on Congress and the federal budget,

1981

I have a 21-inch set bought in 1984, and a 13-inch set bought in 1975 that still work perfectly. I guess it's worth getting one of those converter boxes just for the psychological pleasure of keeping such old stuff working. If the government coupons ever get here.

The 44.1 KHz rate used with CDs works fine, to my ears.

That's true for an (exactly) 22.05 KHz sine wave, but I can't hear that high anyway. For a 16 KHz sinewave, I know it works perfectly, and though I can't hear that either, it's nice to know.

By digitizing everything, the signals can be compressed. Each successive frame of HDTV carries just the update information from the previous frame, which saves transmitting a lot of redundant information, and so saves plenty of bandwidth. I can't imagine doing that without digitizing. The stations where I live are transmitting several separate video streams over one TV channel bandwidth. One station is transmitting one HD stream, one normal stream, and two of somewhat lower quality, for a total of four.

The problem I have is that they're all transmitting in UHF, and at my present location with a new digital TV and a UHF antenna and rotor on a 10-foot pole on my roof, I can get acceptable continuity of reception only about half the time.

Nothing, except get a higher BW internet connection, and watch YouTube. :-)

--
John

2.0 is the limiting case. You need to sample ever so slightly faster. 44K is actually overkill for sampling audio.

Convert the samples into unit impulses and lowpass filter: you'll get a perfect reproduction of the original sine wave. Perfect.

John

** es; that is why they are so bad on the top end.

** Yeah, yeah, almost everyone mis-interprets or mis-stated the Nyquist criteria. Draw a sine wave on graph paper, then put dots (samples) at twice the frequency. Shift that sampling left or right... Hell, take the 44KHz sampling of 20Khz graphically and sample 2.2 times the drawn sine wave. Ugh.

Compression? Is that lossy or non-lossy.....

$40 to watch *commercials* ??? Half (or more) of air time is commercials, even on (cable) stations that were supposed to be free.........

It is either impossible or too expensive for me to get more BW than what POTS gives me, so YouTube is a non-option.

Learn to read before replying. The converters retail for about $50. The government will give you a voucher for $40, making it $10 and sales tax.

--
aioe.org is home to cowards and terrorists

Add this line to your news proxy nfilter.dat file
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http://improve-usenet.org/index.html

Talk about the bridge to nowhere! "If the government can find a way to spend your money, they will." Mike Mike

What you are indirectly proposing is a return to vinyl records. The industry did an exceptional job of over coming the problems of a mechanical recording, but ended up merely minimizing, rather than eliminating, them. Here is an excerpt from Wikipedia:

In the early days of compact discs, vinyl records were still prized by audiophiles because of better reproduction of analog recordings; however, the drawback was greater sensitivity to scratches and dust. Early compact discs were perceived by many as thin and sharp-- distorting sounds on the high end. In some cases, this was the result of record companies issuing CDs produced from master recordings that were compressed and equalized for vinyl. Early consumer compact disc players may have contained 14-bit digital-to-analog converters, instead of the correct 16-bit type, as a cost-cutting measure. Some players were only linear to 10 or 12 bits.[9]

Though digital audio technology has improved over the years, some audiophiles still prefer what they perceive as the sound of vinyl over CDs.

Proponents of digital audio state these differences are generally inaudible to normal human hearing, and the lack of clicks, hiss and pops from analog recordings greatly improved sound fidelity. Modern anti-aliasing filters and oversampling systems used in digital recordings have reduced the problems observed with early CDs.

The "warmer" sound of analog records is generally believed on both sides of the argument to be an artifact of harmonic distortion and signal compression. This phenomenon of a preference for the sound of a beloved lower-fidelity technology is not new; a 1963 review of RCA Dynagroove recordings notes that "some listeners object to the ultra- smooth sound as ... sterile ... such distortion-forming sounds as those produced by loud brasses are eliminated at the expense of fidelity. They prefer for a climactic fortissimo to blast their machines ..."

The theory that vinyl records can audibly represent lower frequencies that compact discs cannot (making the recording sound "warmer") is largely a myth--according to Red Book specifications, the compact disc has a frequency response of 20 Hz to 22.05 kHz, while the human auditory system is sensitive to frequencies from 20 Hz to a maximum of around 20,000 Hz. This means that any frequencies that a vinyl record can represent that a compact disc cannot would be inaudible and thus completely subliminal. Note that the lower frequency limit of human hearing can vary per person, and that interference caused by sound in the lower inaudible spectrum can still influence audible sound. It's possible that phonograph intermodulation effects from low frequency sources such as rumble and wow could adversely effect audible frequency ranges.

[...]

Can be either, but DTV is lossy..

Frame-to-frame video doesn't change much, so new frames can be very compactly coded as "the previous frame plus these few changes." Color information can be quantized; interlacing, and visual tricks thin the data even further.

If you don't mind a little "lossiness", very high compression ratios result. Roughly 100:1, depending.

Cheers, James Arthur

Actually, commercials are limited to 1/3rd (by FCC edict?). You can save 18 minutes per hour by taping. (We see, however, twice as many commercial-minutes today as were allowed in the 60's.)

BTW, Chairman Hundt's speech of 1997 sheds some light on the DTV process. Seems the FCC then was eager to reclaim analog channels so they could resell the spectrum. But, broadcasters can keep their analog channels if 5% of the audience lacks digital capacity, so conversion is in the government's interest.

Thusly is explained this unholy alliance between socialists and industry.

[1]

Cheers, James Arthur

~~~~ [1] "As stated in the Commission's order on digital television, the target date for the transition from analog to digital television is

2006. If broadcasters promote DTV, the great majority of Americans will have converted to digital by buying set top boxes, digital cable, digital satellite, digital tv, or personal computers set up to receive DTV. As the deadline approaches, broadcasters would have an incentive to distribute the equipment to keep their audience share, and thus their advertising revenues. So, penetration levels increase.

But if 5% of the audience doesn't have the capacity to receive the new signal, then broadcasters can keep both channels under proposed legislation. Where does this number come from? Almost 5 percent of the country doesn't have active telephone service. This is regarded as a small percentage that does not drive our telephone policies, though we continue to make efforts to reduce the gap. More than 5% of the country probably thinks there is no such thing as "Must See TV." Why should that growing block of silence lovers drive TV policy?

The American public was promised that it would get the spectrum back for new, flexible uses. The digital spectrum, worth millions of dollars in potential advertising and other revenues, was given to existing broadcasters for free, as a loan in exchange for the analog spectrum. When the analog licenses are returned, we can create new opportunities for women, minorities, small businesses, new programmers and new would-be networks, to acquire spectrum for any use. We must ensure that promise is kept to create fair opportunities for all Americans."

James Arthur wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@s12g2000prg.googlegroups.com:

BUT,I have more than 2 TVs,and a VCR. And the converter boxes do not work with the VCR for timed-recordings;they aren't programmable for time and channel. I also lost a major network channel.(CH.2 NBC)

the major beef is that it was not government's business,it should have been a market decision.(FREE-market)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

John O'Flaherty wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

I got mine a couple of weeks ago.You are better off waiting,as the 'best' converter box,the Echostar TR-40,wil not be available until June/July,and the $40 coupons expire after 90 days. (Orlando,Fl.) all the other converters cost MORE than the $40,so you pay extra plus sales tax.My Magnavox TB-100MW9 cost me $14 after coupon.

And the format menu is a PITA;to go from letterbox to full or zoom requires going into a menu,and the channel switch buttons are TINY and badly placed.(remote control) It also does not work with a VCR for timed recordings;you can't program the converter,you have to leave it ON the channel you want.

OTOH,I got all the UHF channels,and lost the low VHF Ch.2,NBC. All my VHF DTV channels are marginal,often go 'frozen' or pixellated.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com:

No. the change from vinyl to other media was NOT mandated by government,but by consumer market conditions;the people voted by their spending choices. Vinyl is still around and still useable,BTW.

With DTV,the people had no choice in the matter.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Go get a certificate from the government to save a few bucks on a converter box. Or, ditch the TV in protest (place it in the front yard with a protest poster on a stick) and don't watch any of the digi-programming. After all, you've probably seen all the episodes of Gilligan's Island by now. What else is there to watch?

Absolutely true.

A Star Trek episode from the original 1968 series was exactly 50 minutes long. Now, a "Lost" episode is less than 45 minutes long.