FPGA choice advice needed

hello all,

Could someone give me an advice of the best FPGA(s) that meets following requirements:

Application: PCI board to be connected to an automotive bus (CAN, or LIN, or FlexRay etc...), an IP will be integrated for each of thoses busses (only 1 bus type per PCI board, several channels).

The application must include:

- a 5V PCI target core (32 bit, 33Mhz), how much does this cost?

- the PCI core owns a Win98 (option: Linux) driver and an API to map the dual port RAM (ie: the application gets a pointer to the dual port RAM and use it as memory without any function to be called when accessing PCI hardware), how much does this cost?

- a dual port RAM core (maybe with anti collision feature or boundary areas), with a size of at least 512kbit or a large FIFO, how much does this cost? What is the RAM size range that is possible to build in a FPGA?

- the automotive bus IP core (I will code it)

- a non BGA package because of higher production cost and hardware debug difficulties and low pin count (

Reply to
Mouarf
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I've recently assisted implementing a pci slave in a Lattice EC device. That was 3.3v pci. The reference design on Lattice's website take ~ 1k LUTs. As far as the embedded ram, you're not going to get 500k in a non BGA package from anyone. You need to either use two devices or use a BGA. CAN controller should be less than 2k LUTs. Don't think Lattice has a free micro, but you can get 8051s & such from open cores. Here is the product table for the EC family.

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Reply to
Teo

Teo a écrit :

OK, thanks for your feedback

Do you know how was the PCI driver implemented? Are you talking about this PCI controller

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?

My problem with opencore uC cores is that I did not find any suitable with powerfull development tool (compiler and debugger)...

Reply to
Mouarf

Here is the free reference design for pci 32 bit slave.

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Not sure exactly what features you want in a compiler & debugger, but there are some out there like

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Reply to
Teo

Mouarf,

If you need a 512Kb fifo, check out the Stratix I and II parts from Altera. The M-RAMs are 576Kb. However, I don't know if $40 is going to possible, especially when you add in the cost for a programming PROM. Same is true for the Xilinx V2P or V4s. As for PCI cores, both Xilinx and Altera have cores that require an annual fee. Price depends on if it is a slave or master core. As far as I know Altera and Xilinx only support 3.3V PCI. Why do you need 5V? Finally, you're not going to get a free 16b or 32b microprocessor core unless you use an open source solution. That said, both Xilinx and Altera have IP you can purchase. I would expect the fees would be similar to a PCI core.

John

Reply to
John M

John M a écrit :

OK a PCI 3,3V would fit but do you have an idea about prices for IPs (PCI target, processor, CAN etc...)?

Reply to
Mouarf

At this link the source is free for a pci 32 bit slave.

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Don't know about CAN controller costs, you might want to use a discrete device to avoid the IP price. Open cores is best for free processors. Good luck.

Reply to
Teo

If you are just looking to experiment then the Xilinx PCI Core can be run on evaluation mode. Buy costs vary on license 32bit / 33MHz of the order $2000-5000. If you are a student there are education licensing as well. I believe there is one on opencores but it;s size may be quite large.

$40 does not go far and Virtex and Stratix families are almost certainly out of that range unless you happen to be an extremely large user or go for the smallest parts in the range. For automotive applications Spartan-3 is a good fit for your application although I'm a bit biased to Xilinx. It is getting very difficult to get parts that are not BGA, or fine pitch like the QFN, let alone larger parts in an easy to use package. We should have something for hobby / student market in the shape of a low cost module in 2/3 months to assist with this problem.

For simple size comparision I would use number of raw LUTs and flip-flops followed by memory size /organisation. The latter is not always simple as block rams can sometimes be inefficient for given applications. Xilinx have an advantage in this area with the ability to do local rams and shift register elements SRL16s from LUTs. This resource is in addition to block rams.

Low cost processors I would look at opencores. Processors like MicoBlaze can be evaluated free but the kit does cost $495 if you need to buy the license.

If you need a very large memory then bear in mind that FPGA ram is relatively expensive. However standalone Dual Port Memories are getting expensive too. For the large FIFO consider using a single interface memory ram, or dram, and use your FPGA as a controller to time multiplex access the data reads and writes. Smaller FIFOs are good things to do in your FPGA.

John Adair Enterpoint Ltd. - Home of MINI-CAN, PCI and CAN Development Board.

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Reply to
John Adair

many thanks for these answers and advices.

Some more questions:

- How is the IP licence managed? I mean, in evaluation mode, is there a time limite (or whatever) in ISE web edition, is it downloadable or do I need to get in touch with Xilinx sales men?

- When buying IP, are there royalties on each PCI board sold? What is the difference in the IP with those different licence? Are there some limitations?

- Are IP availble in a complete set of VHDL code etc or is it a precompiled file set?

- Could you give me a link to Xilinx PCI IP core, there are many available on their website, I don't know which you are talking about?

My project is mainly an evaluation/learning project. I want to learn FPGA designs with a real and complete project (software, driver, digital design, hardware) that could be done in any company (I've studied VHDL/ Verilog years ago but only with simulations).

Since my budget is not so large, I would like to least estimate my project costs (with commercial IP in evaluation mode first, then if the project is a succes, I plan to buy them) before starting and asking for funds to some company that would be interested in this project (some are ready to help me and wait for my budget estimation).

Best regards

John Adair a écrit :

Reply to
Mouarf

Hope not being too much OT here.

I think the cheapest PCI platform might well be the MaxII kit. Alas, the MaxII doesn't have the "guts" to be an SOPC platform, so if you absolutely want an embedded processor, you'll need another board. But if you first want to get familiar with PCI and test an actual solution, it might be an easy start.

Bert Cuzeau

Reply to
info_

thanks,

these board seems to be cheap but my goal is more designing digital around automotive busses than coding drivers and learn PCI bus.

I bookmarked this board.

info_ a écrit :

Reply to
Mouarf

Automotive busses aren't very complex so if you want to build a PCI card interfacing with many automotive busses, then this board might definitely be a player. Ethernet and some of the heavy higher protocol layers that are often involved today are practically begging for a CPU and an operating system (with these layers already available!), but for automotive busses, HDL solutions should be viable.

Bert

Reply to
info_

Start here

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. There is a button for IP on the page follow that. I have not given the direct link as you get a lot of garbage in the header.

John Adair Enterpoint Ltd. - Home of Broaddown2. The Ultimate Spartan3 Development Board.

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Reply to
John Adair

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