No, he said *LATCHING* relays have infinite gain, which was understood by everyone who had any interest in understanding. Some had another agenda.
Then the hens started cackling.
Re: Larkin in an advertisement...
Jun 25, 2011
156 Replies
surprising
What did I miss, then?
Actually, it doesn't boil down to that, since what Larkin stated was
that _latching_ relays have infinite gain.
Be fair.
@Michael:
With all due respect, why not bow out when you're out of your element?
And it latches, with no power? That would be infinite gain.
Maybe they needed the eggs?
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.
The latch takes zero power (mechanical or magnetic latch), though it takes energy to change state.
Maybe there is a reason but I doubt it.
I realized I left out 'latching' as I hit send, but it doesn't matter. That thread was a long running mess.
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.
No problem. I killfile Larkin a while back I am up to 85 users and sock puppets. This group used to be interesting, but it is slowing circling the drain with:
Personal attacks Whining AGW Anti gun nuts Politics and a lot of idiotic threads that degrade into cockfights.
At one time there were a lot of discussions about circuits, choosing component from several sources and comparing one method against another without turning into drunken bitch fights.
We have a troll that has already destroyed news:alt.engineering.electrical and is doing his damnedest to trash this group. Instead of ignoring him, several regulars keep arguing with him, giving him the attention he wants. Go ahead and help him finish of the group, I no longer give a damn.
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.
You're right, Michael. I will henceforth make an effort to ignore his posts no matter how provocative they are.
Hmm... a quote from Wikipedia:
"In real analysis, the symbol ?, called "infinity", denotes an unbounded limit. "
Seems that John is right from a theoretical as well as a practical point of view doesn't it? Certainly "infinite gain" seems one reasonable way to express the situation.
John Devereux
"
Miss Denton, in sixth grade, taught us that "infinity" is not a number, but "infinite" is an adjective. If there exists some value, but you can't assign any fixed upper limit to it, you can describe that value as infinite.
"The power gain is infinite" means that you can't name a real number that's greater than the gain. Literally "not finite."
We're engineers, and that works for us. Stuff gets built and it works.
John
As an old SxS maintainer, it was often amazing how much logic could be contained in a few relays! And I worked in basic SxS. Some of the concentrator offices literally had a relay computer to route calls...
Charlie
Regardless of what you say Miss Denton taught you, the fact remains
that the power gain can only _approach_ infinity, so saying that the
relay _has_ infinite gain is just plain wrong.
As far as naming a number that's greater than the gain of the relay
goes, how's this:
Pout
n = ------ + 1
Pin
YOW! I just went over there and had a look; what a mess!!!
That's not a number, that's an equation.
The wrong equation, to boot.
John
limit. "
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Speak for yourself :)
Jamie
Yes, of course.
Everyone knows that, but solving it will yield a number which will
always be larger than the gain of the relay, hence the gain of the
relay can never be infinite since "n" will always be larger.
That's equivalent to saying that no value N can ever be unbounded, because N+1 is always its bound.
If you believe that, you'll believe the sign on the bar in Truckee,
FREE BEER TOMORROW
John
A newly established unit of measure...
Infinite Ignorance = 1 milli-Larkin ;-) ...Jim Thompson
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
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I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
Indeed and, therefore, your relay can never have have infinite gain.
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