Tesla is fast

No comparison whatsoever - the average age of ICE cars is much older than EVs, and fires are much more frequent in old cars. Lithium batteries suffer from, among manner other things, shorts due to dendrite growth, which takes time to occur. Also, ICE car fires occur primarily when driven, while EVs can catch fire ANYTIME, and do. And when they do catch fire, the fire is impossible to put out and the car must burn to exhaustion at extremely high temperatures. Furthermore, airplanes undergo regular mandated inspection and periodic rebuilding, and MUST comply with all mandatory airworthiness directives - cars do not. Didn't anticipate that, did you?

Whoosh! So again.... "the most economic are being mined now", so what does that make the others..... er.... let me see.... LESS economic.

Go watch people rolling coal on Teslas, it's funny as f*ck. Keep your toxic highly explosive lithium to yourself.

When did ICE become "Internal Combustion Engine"? When I were a lad, "ICE" on a classified ad meant "In Car Entertainment", as in the car I'm selling has a stereo.

Perhaps.... we should just stop using acronyms?

A truck is 50 tonnes and I doubt they will ever use batteries.

Is that Beverly? Can you actually speak English?

You won't get that from a battery. No battery of any chemistry is of much use after 5 years, used a lot or not.

And I bet that "warranty" only covers the first user.

We're realists.

The question is how less economic.

The amount of Lithium required to run every single car in the world is enormous. It's a rare element. Batteries need to be made of something else. Preferably something that doesn't quadruple the cost of the vehicle.

Obama Bin Laden? ROFL!

Lithium is not a rare element ....

The approximate amount of lithium on earth is between 30 and 90 million tons.

Cars require 20 million tons. Rather close.... so can we really mine two thirds of it, and then recycle 100% of that forever more?

I've always thought it strange and wonderful that elements are so nicely concentrated in heaps for us. I could imagine a planet where everything is uniformly mixed and things like gold, uranium, iron, copper, aluminum, lithium, rare earths, and helium are hard to separate.

Natural gas and oil are nice too.

I guess it depends if the planet was formed from a big glob or from several different kinds of globs that smashed together.

Apparently some elements are found in most concentrated form in landfill sites.

Huh? In elemental composition of the Earth's crust, Li is twenty-fifth most common. See here, for a more complete breakdown

The only way to make a finding of 90 million tons is to ignore every rock that hasn't been declared part of a current Lithium mining claim, i.e. assume only today's lithium mines contain all the Earth's lithium element. That's a world-size error.

The problem isn't abundance, it's concentration.

There's lots of lithium in the ocean, 0.2 PPM, too expensive to extract.

... There is some validity to that but fires as a result of accident are actually more likely with newer cars.

Hyundai and Kia have had to recently recall close to half a million recently manufactured cars in the US because of the risk of the cars spontaneously catching fire when turned off - they even recommend parking them outside.

kw

On Saturday, 21 May 2022 at 09:02:01 UTC-7, Commander Kinsey wrote: ...

I guess my 4 1/2 year old Tesla is going to expire soon then.

No - it's transferable.

kw

On Saturday, 21 May 2022 at 10:02:46 UTC-7, Commander Kinsey wrote: ...

...

The amount of oil required to run every single car in the world is enormous. Oil is rare. We only have about 47 years left at current consumption rates.

Luckily we have over 150 years worth of lithium and we will probably come up with other chemistries that don't require it.

The other alkali metals are good candidates for use instead of lithium. Sodium in particular is plentiful and very easy to get.

Many EV car companies are already using Lithium iron phosphate cathodes to avoid the need for cobalt and nickel.

kw

Yeah, the ocean is a dilute ore for lots of things. There's lots of ancient dead seas, though, where lots of concentration happened, for free, eons ago. The 'economic' place is always the closest to mass transport and cheapest to extract. Other sites for mining that aren't worth developing this year, will be ready when mine #1 empties. Next year, a few dollars per ton of price hike won't bankrupt anyone.

But "proven reserves" have been increasing linearly for about 100 years now. And lots of places haven't been explored.

The 'proven reserves' are a match to expected consumption: no one looks for new well sites that won't be needed for thirty years. That linear increase has nothing to do with supply, only demand.

Would you wait thirty years for YOUR paycheck?

They're scraping ocean bottoms at fantastic depths already; the best cheap extraction sites are going if not gone, and tar sands are the new definition of 'economic' (that definition isn't working out well). Peak oil is perhaps behind us already.

Exactly. When we need more oil, we drill and get it.

That linear increase has nothing

Peak Oil has been predicted as imminent since the 1800's. The predictions have been, as they say, "premature"