failure

See this, for one such example:

Jon

_OTHER KINDS_ of faith? My gosh. Well, at least it is clear how you see science theory and result.

Jon

I read in sci.electronics.design that Jim Thompson wrote (in ) about 'failure', on Sat,

24 Sep 2005:

It depends how 'intelligent design' is introduced.

Acceptable: Evolution by natural selection is a very soundly-based scientific theory, with masses of confirming evidence. Nevertheless, some people think that living things are so complex and so beautifully fitted to their environment that some superhuman intelligence must have influenced their design.

NOT acceptable: Evolution is only a theory and has never been proved. Living things are so wonderful that they must have been designed by a superhuman intelligence.

Once you decide that kids mustn't be told about some things, you are on a very slippery slope indeed. Who decides what mustn't be told? Why shouldn't they be told?

--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
If everything has been designed, a god designed evolution by natural selection.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk

Then you are tolerant; a lot of "scientific" people aren't. Given that there are lots of things still unexplained by science (and perhaps can never be explained within the rules and dimensions of *this* universe) rabid hostility to other ways of thinking becomes a religion in itself.

When I see those fish-Darwin chrome thingies on the backs of Volvos, I think "what a jerk you are to publicly mock people you don't even know, including most of your own ancestors." The other thing I think is "Volvo! Bad driver!"

I'm still waiting for somebody to tell me where this universe came from.

John

So, are you saying that uninformed opinion makes your sad conflation any truer?

Some do. Experimental scientists are also good engineers. Since, by definition, at least these do science the above cannot be true.

I've no idea what this is about. Seems to be a change of subject.

It wouldn't cause me to conflate the two, as you appear to do.

Jon

The correlation between driving Volvos and driving badly is seriously positive around here, and I'm always pleasantly surprised on the rare occasion when I encounter an exception. But the prudent assumption to make is that they'll run stop signs, cut off smaller cars, chase pedestrians out of crosswalks, and generally break the rules when they have the option. Volvo+cell phone practically guarantees hazard.

Drivers of small Toyotas and classic sports cars seem to be the best.

John

Gosh, seemed like an interesting question.

I would't scorn such a suggestion. What annoys me is people who are intolerant of other's beliefs in situations where there is no proof, and maybe can never be.

That is possible. Do you disagree?

"Moral direction?" That's pretty unscientific.

John

Some Christian types decorate their cars with a little stylized chrome fish symbol

which is rarely seen here on the Left Coast. What you do see (generally on Volvos) is the parody version,

and numerous variants, like

which apparently make some people think they're sophisticated or something.

John

I see. You only "tolerate" things you agree with, and scorn everything else. That's a new definition of "toleration."

John

I read in sci.electronics.design that John Larkin wrote (in ) about 'failure', on Sat,

24 Sep 2005:

What are they? Should I have one on the back of my Volvo?

Oh, you've observed my driving? I think "what a jerk you are to publicly mock people you don't even know."

--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
If everything has been designed, a god designed evolution by natural selection.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk

I read in sci.electronics.design that Richard the Dreaded Libertarian wrote (in ) about 'failure', on Sat,

24 Sep 2005:

Not 100%, surely? He warned about the baleful influence of the 'military-industrial complex'.

--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
If everything has been designed, a god designed evolution by natural selection.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk

--
You believe, then, that because your "reasonably-held beliefs" make
sense to you and others\' don\'t, that that gives you license to
determine what should be scorned and what shouldn\'t?  Hitleresque,
ISTM.

[snip] [snip]

"Volvo! Bad driver!" Bwahahahaha!

...Jim Thompson

-- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | |

| 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

--
Depends.  Is the \'i\' hard or soft?

"Here's a nice and simple emblem, a T-Rex eating a fish. Now, if only religion could go the way of the dinosaur."

"According the screwy Xian doctrine of original sin, we're all sinners anyway. Might as well show it off."

"Science fish for those who have evolved beyond this earth. The Science emblem has rocket fins to help you in lift off and navigation. Without science we'd still be eating raw meat and sleeping in caves."

Nice guy, huh? I bet he'd be selling KKK robes if it paid as well.

John

I know a number of religious people, Christian, Jew, Muslim, and Buddhist, and none of them have that attitude; are you personally acquainted with "very many" intolerant believers? Jesus is on record as being rather tolerant, if you recall from Sunday School lessins.

Really, the level of anti-religious bigotry and baseless stereotyping is impressive; I suspect some dark psychological basis. It seems to be a lot more common among engineers and techs, as opposed to true scientists, which is also interesting.

John

Apologies for straying on-topic, but I find that people who nurture prejudices make rotten electronic designers. Design starts with opening up your head to all possibilities, toying with them more or less sincerely, and picking the most practical for the case at hand. And not learning *too* much from experience.

John

John Woodgate wrote: (snip)

There are many variations as alternatives to the left facing fish that symbolizes Christianity.

I read in sci.electronics.design that Clifford Heath wrote (in ) about 'failure', on Sun, 25 Sep 2005:

I don't think cosmogonists have admitted defeat at all. Events can, with varying degrees of confidence, be traced back to the age of the Universe being about 10^-33 s. Earlier than that, the energy is so high that the physics is as yet unknown. But it may well not remain unknown for ever.

--
Regards, John Woodgate, OOO - Own Opinions Only.
If everything has been designed, a god designed evolution by natural selection.
http://www.jmwa.demon.co.uk Also see http://www.isce.org.uk