Tell Telstra to stop sending you dead trees. - Page 5

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Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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<http://www.energyaustralia.com.au/State/NSW/Business/Small-and-medium-business/Your-account/~/media/Files/Business/SME/Your%20Energy%20Agreement/BusinessCustomerPriceList09.ashx

http://www.energyaustralia.com.au/State/NSW/Residential/Products-and-services/Electricity/~/media/Files/Residential/Pricing/2010/NSW_RES_PL.ashx

Not particularly. In fact if you look at the Powersmart rates, business
does better than residential on every aspect of their charging. On the
General Supply All Time tariff business pay 26.4 cents per day extra (a
bit under $100 per year), but have better usage charges.

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Smart meters capture the higher costs of power during the peaks of the
daily usage cycle, but they still don't capture the costs associated
with infrequent high loads such as are created by airconditioning on hot
days. Essentially, part of the infrastructure exists just to service
those loads, but it is mostly not used. The price that people pay when
they do use it does not cover its cost.

Sylvia.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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I thought one of the smart meter results would be that people pay higher
rates on peak demand days?  At least in Vic we're going to be charged by
the 30 minute block, and that charge will vary.  It's on the site for the
Victorian smart meter rollout, that capability wont come in for a while
yet until they get the automated bill data collection (wireless) working.
Some years away yet.

Grant.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra




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That was my understanding.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


wrote:
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<http://www.energyaustralia.com.au/State/NSW/Business/Small-and-medium-business/Your-account/~/media/Files/Business/SME/Your%20Energy%20Agreement/BusinessCustomerPriceList09.ashx
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http://www.energyaustralia.com.au/State/NSW/Residential/Products-and-services/Electricity/~/media/Files/Residential/Pricing/2010/NSW_RES_PL.ashx
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Smart meters are already in use in NSW for some customers, and are being
progressively rolled out for all. The price per kWh varies during the
day, and also depends on whether it's a week day, or weekend. However,
the price in each period is fixed, and stated in advance. It does not
depend on the actual total load on the network. In particular, it does
not rise steeply on very hot days when the load goes up significantly
because of the use of air conditioners.

While charging more during periods of unsually high demand would be
possible, there is a problem in that consumers would not know at any
given time how much they are paying for the electricity they are
consuming. I think that would be politically very difficult.

Sylvia.



Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra




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Which smart meter?
my understanding is that it is easy for the consumer to find out costs
and consequently adjust their power demands. Basically the whole
rationale for them.
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Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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The main rationale for them is that they capture the regularly varying
costs of supplying electricity not that they capture the high costs of
exceptional peaks. There is no provision of realtime pricing information
to consumers.

Sylvia.


Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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My impression was that the meter would show current price, could be
wrong -- I'll take much more interest one I get one fitted here.  We
cannot ask to jump the queue, but one of the trial ones is only 30km
from my place (Castlemaine).

Going to take some time.  The people who leave their aircos on all day
while out at work are spoiling for others, as the govt in Vic doesn't
want to build another smelly power station, we got lots of the crappiest
brown 'coal' to burn, it's mostly water and thus not very efficient.

Grant.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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Variable tariffs are more about shifting demand than reducing it,
because peaks are expensive to handle. There is a certain irony in that
the more successful variable tariffs are in flattening the load curve,
the more scope power generation companies have to build coal fired
stations rather than less polluting gas fired stations.

Sylvia.


Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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But solar nicely fits with modern airco usage.  Because people demand
their summer comfort cooling?  My electricity peak is winter heating,
only a couple fans for summer.  

Grant.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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The correlation between sunlight availability and airconditioning demand
is certainly high, but it's nothing like 100%, meaning that provision
would still have to be made for high airconditioning load at times when
the sun is sufficiently obscured to compromise solar power generation.

Photovoltaic solar power generation would also be an exceptionally
expensive way of supporting the demand for air conditioning if it were
only used when airconditioning was required.

In practice of course, the power solar panels generate is used whenever
it is available, displacing the grid power generation with the highest
marginal cost, thus decreasing the economic viability of that generation
plant, which in turn feeds into higher electricity prices. Greenies also
need to be aware that it would change the finances of natural gas
powered generators, with the result that less efficient (i.e. more CO2
releasing) plants would be built.

A much cheaper solution is for people to own petrol generators capable
of providing occasional power, and for those to be used at time of high
airconditioning loads. I looked at buying one a while back out of
concern that the grid would fail to handle peak loads during heat waves,
though I couldn't quite convince myself of the need, and it didn't
happen - that summer at least.

Sylvia.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra




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Nope, they just assume that you have left a tap running and that the
meter has looped and bill you for the lot.


Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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I thought this was implausible, so in the spirit of scientific
endeavour, I took a look at my meter and did some measurements. Turns
out that if I leave a tap running fully open, it will loop the meter in
about 100 days, which is uncomfortably close to the meter reading cycle.
This suggests that a simple meter reading error can lead to disputes
later on about whether the water was actually consumed. An extra digit
on the meter would have resolved that.

Sylvia.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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If you were going to cheat it would better to make a connection
underground to the mains side And take half your water usage off that,
or make a bypass circuit that allows some water through meter and some not.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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Yes, this is called a shunt. I believe some unscrupulous
thieves have done this the past.   For electricity & gas
too.




Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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Seems hardly worth the effort for water.

Sylvia.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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Exactly, nevertheless a shunt has the advantage of bleeding
off a fixed proportion of the supplied items.



Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


And more...

First some definitions in the Electricity (Consumer Safety) Act, which
are imported into the Home Building Act.

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http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/esa2004309
/s3.html#electrical_installation

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Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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Except that there are regulations about fixed wiring on your side of
the plug and the way things are wired on your side of the plug.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra


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I'm happy to comply with the regulations - I just want to be allowed to
do the work.

Sylvia.

Re: DIY electrical and aircon - was Tell Telstra



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As a tradie or job related, or sideline when needed at home?

Grant.

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