OKI ARM MPUs

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I am curious.  I have seen a lot of posts here about Atmel ARM chips and
even the small Philips ARM chip, but I have not seen much if anything
about the OKI line of ARM MCUs.  

Are people not aware of them, or do they just not think much of them.
The ML67Q4003 and ML67Q5003 are cheap, effective and come in some small
packages.  Unlike the Philips chip they have an external bus.  Is no one
using the OKI parts?  What is wrong with them?  

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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
Technically you're maybe right but the japanese business model is for big
firms, not for a small manufacturer! I had personal problems several times I
used "japanese only" chips.
I think if you want buying a CPU do not use japs. Try US or European.
- Henry


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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
I hear what you are saying.  I am not getting great support since I have
to use the local rep who writes his FAE who contacts factory support who
gets the developer...  you get the idea.  I once got an email back that
had been forwarded some 8 or more times.  It was hard to even figure out
who sent what to whom.  

But I am getting good support from the local people.  They have gotten
me a good price and I expect to see a development board in about a
month.  The bottom line is that there are no alternatives for this chip
at the moment.  The Philips chips don't have an external bus, the
Micronas chips use a fat package, TI does not acknowlege they even make
an ARM CPU unless you are building automobiles and everyone else making
them *is* Japaneese or other asian.  So what is the alternative?  


Henry wrote:
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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
That's right! The TI parts is the TMS470, for example used by Bosch (car
electronics). I will use the LPC210x. I never had problems with Philips. In
fact, I think Philips is the only manufacturer stayed in the old business
model after all the semiconductor industry changed mine. I like the old
model just I liked Motorola 68k before they went to "DNA" (shit can
think??).
It's a mystery why Philips omitted the external bus interface. A 32kHz clock
PLL is also missing. Maybe they want selling future or custom devices I'm
not aware of ??? I like the i2c bus for connecting all the stuff on the pcb.
Even the LPC210x is interchangable because I run a virtual machine on the
ARM... (I learned my lessions).

Cheers -
Henry


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times I



Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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 The BUS issue is simply a pin-count one. Their first release is right
into the uC space, which is new for the ARM core, but Philips are
talking
about 64 and 144 pin package models, so as that firms up, I'm
sure external BUS options will appear.
 There are other benefits of on-chip FLASH : in the LPC21xx I think they
have a 128bit FLASH interface, so can get MUCH higher memory bandwiwth
than an external 16 bit wide FLASH part - and you'll fine FLASH speed
is the bottleneck these days.
 External DATA BUS makes sense for peripherals, like Ethernet
controllers...
-jg

Re: OKI ARM MPUs
Hmm. For a mux bus we need about a dozen pins. It would be possible with 44
pins case. Even a Ethernet controller is available for connecting via i2c.
- Henry

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In
clock
pcb.



Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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Never heared of one.
Is it really a complete ethernet controller or do you mean a
doughter board with separate uC and ethernet?


Re: OKI ARM MPUs
It is an Ethernet controller but needs the PHY transceiver IC extra.
If you really need the type I will see on my harddisk (My brain cannot be
upgraded with a bigger disk :)
Please trigger me with private email...

BTW: CS8900 is an Ethernet controller with integrated PHY for 10MBit only.

- Henry

Erik Hermann schrieb in Nachricht ...
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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
The dropped the external bus so it would fit in a tiny package.  

What virtual machine do you run?


Henry wrote:
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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
I'm not sure about my further software (Tinyboot, Avise, etc). Something
like Forth ...
- Henry

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In
clock
pcb.
big
and
small
one
XY



Re: OKI ARM MPUs



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What about Atmel?

Leon


Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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I am pretty sure I discussed my part selection process here about 4-6
months ago.  The Atmel 55800 was my first choice because of the great
peripherals it had.  But the flash is external.  Even on the chips with
builtin flash the flash is a second chip and a flaw on the external bus
can prevent them from booting up.  This is the boot monitor and board
controller.  If it does not come up, the board can't tell you what is
wrong.  With the OKI ARM chip it only has to have clock, power and reset
to come up and start looking at the board.  I plan to use this in
production to test the boards.  

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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs

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Don't know.

Memec seem to be pushing them heavily.

Sharp chips seem quite popular. Sharp also provides an recent version of =
gcc
for download once you have registered.
http://www.sharpsma.com/sma/Products/mcu_soc/Registration/Arm-Bluestreak -=
Library.htm

Have philips just seem to becoming available for sale.
Distributors here only seem to have samples.

cheapest boards with Sharp arms I've come across so far are :

marmalade US$299 with 7.8" touch screen
http://www.earthlcd.com/marmalade.htm
 LCD interface, *ethernet, 7.8" Panasonic EDMGRB8KJF touch screen, touch =
screen controller,20%
 2 pwm, 1 parallel port, 2 serial ports, IR port, min 4 meg flash, 16 =
meg SDRAM, 75 Mhz LH79520.20%
compact flash and smart mdia slots

revealy $199   http://www.revely.com /
75 Mhz  LH79520 ,vga ,  RS232 port,  PS/2 keyboard interface and a =
MultimediaCard slot.20%
 8MB SDRAM , 4MB Flash Memory20%

Anyone else spotted cheap ones ?

Alex Gibson


Re: OKI ARM MPUs
Try DIL40 board for $107
http://cgi.burntec.plus.com/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_TinyArm_22.html
Don't know a cheaper one??
If you're able to hack a mobile phone you have a much cheaper (and smaller
:) one...
(for example Trium phones from Mitsubishi)

- Henry

Alex Gibson schrieb in Nachricht ...

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Don't know.

Memec seem to be pushing them heavily.

Sharp chips seem quite popular. Sharp also provides an recent version of gcc
for download once you have registered.
http://www.sharpsma.com/sma/Products/mcu_soc/Registration/Arm-Bluestreak-Lib
rary.htm

Have philips just seem to becoming available for sale.
Distributors here only seem to have samples.

cheapest boards with Sharp arms I've come across so far are :

marmalade US$299 with 7.8" touch screen
http://www.earthlcd.com/marmalade.htm
LCD interface, *ethernet, 7.8" Panasonic EDMGRB8KJF touch screen, touch
screen controller,
2 pwm, 1 parallel port, 2 serial ports, IR port, min 4 meg flash, 16 meg
SDRAM, 75 Mhz LH79520.
compact flash and smart mdia slots

revealy $199   http://www.revely.com /
75 Mhz  LH79520 ,vga ,  RS232 port,  PS/2 keyboard interface and a
MultimediaCard slot.
8MB SDRAM , 4MB Flash Memory

Anyone else spotted cheap ones ?

Alex Gibson




Re: OKI ARM MPUs

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What about with a similar feature set to the
boards I mentioned before ?

arm, vga or lcd out, ethernet, rs232 or 422 or 485, parallel, flash or =
smart media card ?

Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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http://www.sharpsma.com/sma/Products/mcu_soc/Registration/Arm-Bluestreak-Library.htm
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screen controller,
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SDRAM, 75 Mhz LH79520.
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MultimediaCard slot.
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I have seen the Sharp parts, but they are not complete since they don't
have on chip flash.  Originally I had picked the Atmel 55x800 or
something similar.  But I wanted the chip to boot without external flash
since it is the boot monitor on this board.  I want it to run with a
minimum of stuff being right.  OKI is the only part that is complete
(RAM, Flash, peripherals) and has an external bus and comes in a small
package AFAIK.  

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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs

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Hi Rick,

The newer AT91RM9200 has a built in ROM boot, so you can have a second level
boot on parallel flash (8/16 bit), serial EEPROM or serial flash, and if no
valid flash image is around, you can download a 13 kB app into internal SRAM
using Xmodem/UART or USB Device Firmware upgrade.

The packages are 208 TQFP and BGA256, so they are not the smallest you have
seen.



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Best Regards
Ulf at atmel dot com
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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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Thanks, but that is not the same thing.  The real problem is that with
the Atmel ARM parts that have internal flash, a board level defect that
corrupts the external bus also corrupts the flash bus since they are the
same thing.  That gives me a much higher chance that the board will not
boot.  

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Rick "rickman" Collins

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Re: OKI ARM MPUs

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Boggle!  

You're serious?  

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No kidding.  One of advantages I see in parts w/ internal flash
and RAM is that you don't need ICE or JTAG to get a board up
and running.

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Grant Edwards                   grante             Yow!  Is this BOISE??
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Re: OKI ARM MPUs
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But Atmel uses two die on their ARM parts with flash.  They are both
pinned to the same pads on the package.  So if you short a address or
data pin it affects the connection to the flash just as if they were in
two separate packages.  Not a problem for most designs, but for this one
I want the processor to boot with the highest likelyhood I can
reasonably get.  (of course there is no small amount of circuitry to get
the power and clock up... but who's counting?)

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Rick "rickman" Collins

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