Hi, I am looking for cpu for a automotive infotainment project. Project details are 800x600 lcd, graphical charts, graphical user interfaces, audio (MP3 and Radio), CAN Bus communication, probably embedded linux, maybe rear camera and gps, etc. I have been using Renesas M16C series as 16 bit Microcontroller and I need a powerfull 32bit CPU. I don't think use SuperH series because ARM9 has a lot of documets and sources i think. Freescale MX9328MX21S and Atmel SAM9263 or SAM9261 can better choices ? Could you please share your experiences about this subject? Thanks in advance
This feature is not absolute features. There are lots of arm based mobile phones and they have this features expect high lcd resolution. Also ARM9 developmet boards have almost this features.
If you need the automotive infortaiment project to be built on time and done for good, you need a Pentium class industrial PC with WinCE or Embedded XP. If your real goal is to prove something, you may use ARM9, linux or whatsoever.
Vladimir Vassilevsky DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant
You can use e.g. something from DaVinci family from TI. It will work much better than a Pentium-XYZ, you don't need Windoze, it will drive your LCD, videocamera and everything else (probably excluding CAN) right off the chip. It will cost less than Pentium-XYZ and Linux is totally free. You will get all the graphics and GUI you need with it and it will draw 100 times less power.
Don't buy Windoze crap. It is not worth it.
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The AT91SAM9263 has some interesting features for this.
1) Dual bus. Refreshing 800 x 600 x 60 Hz * 16 bpp = 56,25 MB /second If you use a 40 MHz PSRAM you get 80 MB/second (max) so you use 70% of the bandwidth for refresh. The 800 x 600 is just on the border of what you can do on this bus. You can move over to 100 MHz SDRAM and the loading goes down , but you lose the Ethernet controller due to pin muxing.
A good driver will draw the screen in the double buffered memory on the primary bus 100 Mhz 32 bit bus, and will let the DMA controller copy the buffer to a dual buffer on the secondary 16 bit bus.
With a static picture, the display refresh will cause zero overhead on the primary bus
2) There is a GPS receiver on the chip, but it is not documented :-) Use an external chip on a serial port.
3) There is an onboard CAN controller
4) Embedded Linux or WinCE, no problem.
5) The AT91SAM9G41 is basically a SAM9263 running at 400 MHz, (losing the CAN controller, unfortunately) and should be coming out in first samples mid this year, and general sampling (hopefully) late this year. It is not pin compatible, but a lot of the S/W work will be done by then. There will be a H/W video decoder in a version of this.
6) If there is any volume behind this (around 20-30k), then you could consider the AT91CAP9 and an external FPGA for prototyping and then migrate to a customized CAP9 for 150k$
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Best Regards,
Ulf Samuelsson
This is intended to be my personal opinion which may,
or may not be shared by my employer Atmel Nordic AB
Can it run in less than 20mA? Can it deep sleep/hibernate in less than 50uA? Is it possible to add analog comparators, op-amps and charge pumps? Can we specify the pad locations for wafer integrations?
what is the main advantages of Dual External Bus Interface at AT91SAM9263? Can i connect and configure to different RAMs like as embedded computing RAM and video RAM? if yes, can i do it with linux?
Isn't it scary enough that someone is designing an in-car computer based on some vague ideas and advice from a newsgroup, without adding windows on top?
Not to worry. This is just another going to nowhere project which will be fortunately abandoned in a week or two. Or unfortunately abandoned in a year or two after spending several million of dollars. Nothing turns out to be more expensive then the so-called "free" stuff.
Vladimir Vassilevsky DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant
Expensive stuff can turn out to be expensive too - paying a lot is no guarantee for success (though I agree that you're heading for disaster if you base your decisions solely on the initial cost-price of your tools). The expensive thing is a lack of knowledge, experience, and planning in a project - not the cost of the tools or OS.
What is your idea David? Which cpu is ideal for this kind of project? What is the better sides of windows? Why windows is best choice? I think Vladimir can not explain.
I have never worked on the embedded linux. And even i am not aware of any phone available in the market on embedde linux. Can any body provide this information so that i can have a look o this.
The cpu depends on the details of the system, the OS you are running, and how much of the work is off-loaded to dedicated hardware such as video accelerators. As for the "better sides of windows", I can't think of any good sides of windows for a computer in a car - it's simply the wrong choice when you want a reliable system. It is certainly possible that a well-implemented wince system will be more stable and reliable than a badly-implemented linux (for example) system, but if that's your situation, you should not be implementing *any* system in a car.
Remember, if your system goes bananas it's not just the car radio that stops working - you could give the driver incorrect information, you could play horrible sounds at high volumes, you could block important communication on the CAN bus, or do a number of other dangerous mistakes. So your system needs to be very reliable - that's something that embedded windows xp is totally unsuitable for, and wince is only somewhat better. I'm not going to recommend anything - I don't have the experience in this particular area. *You* have to do proper research and investigation - don't believe salesmen, don't believe PHB's that have fallen for the latest buzzwords, and don't believe what you read in public newsgroups.
Because CE simply works, and it is well supported and documented (as opposed to linux incomprehensibility); finding all sorts of components and drivers would not be a problem; most of it is plug and play type of stuff (as opposed to do-it-yourself linux incompleteness); hiring the sensible developers and mediocre supporters (as opposed to the hysterical zealots of linux) would be a lot easier also.
BTW, I am involved in the design of the vehicle entertainment systems. Being the OEM developer, you are liable for your software and hardware, and you are required to use only the approved software and hardware components, and there is a number of tests that your system have to pass. The project that you are talking about weights several hundred thousand lines in C++, this is a pretty serious endeavour so the amateur approach is not feasible.
Vladimir Vassilevsky DSP and Mixed Signal Design Consultant
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