-- Not at all. I\'m always grateful when someone takes the time to correct me and show me where I went wrong, since that increases my store of stuff I know is right. But when a self-important know-nothing windbag like you comes along making baseless proclamations and spouting opinions like they were gospel it _does_ annoy me.
-- Interesting. Thanks, John! BTW, from another thread and just as an aside, I went over to my friend\'s sign shop and checked some known-good neon sign transformers using the same meters I used to check the ones I have here, and it turns out my transformers are defective. :-(
John, you can't have it both ways. You say the above is what you do, but what you actually *do* is the next paragraph:
^^^^^^^^^^^^
When will that begin?
-- Floyd L. Davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) floyd@barrow.com
"Don Bowey" schreef in bericht news:BED47A76.5B46% snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net...
misnomers.
and
learn
more
want
Go on folks, this is all very bloody important.
-- Thanks, Frank. (remove \'q\' and \'invalid\' when replying by email)
triple point ring a bell?
Er..the gospels are the biggest pile of erroneous nonsense one can come up with. Its all about those imaginary beings, that can do anything, be everywhere at once, knows everything etc...
Kevin Aylward snipped-for-privacy@anasoft.co.uk
Look, this isn't an argument, it's just contradiction!
-- Al Brennan "If you only knew the magnificence of the 3, 6 and 9, then you would have a key to the universe." Nicola Tesla
No curve but some info:
--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror:
Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive traffic on Repairfaq.org.
Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs.
Sorry to hear that. I was surprised that I couldn't simply Google this. But the elusive neon sign transformer voltage current curve remains uncaptured.
The tripple-point of water is ~4C, so the freezing point is dependent on pressure, at least somewhat. Here is a phase diagram for water, which shows that the freezing point isn't quite vertical:
It's *ALL* out there. Not *ALL* is correct though. ;-)
-- Keith
Don Lancaster has written many articles for electronics magazines. Also regular columns for several electronics magazines (probably still running). One of his books (CMOS cookbook) was a standard for many years. You might be able to learn something from him too.
Bud--
John Lark> >
Thanks, but this info is more confusing than clarifying.
The table of data at reduced voltage looks pretty linear, and if the normal operating curve is not based on any nonlinear elements, then this should extrapolate to something pretty close to the actual curve.
Table excerpted: " Regulation - Between an open and a short circuit, the core and winding construction results in a quasi-constant current characteristic over much of this range. I did a test on a 12 kV, 30 mA transformer at reduced voltage (I didn't have any way of providing a variable load at full output so I used a Variac to set the no load output voltage to 1,000 VAC): Load Output Voltage Output Current ------------------------------------------- Open 1,000 VAC 0.00 mA R 560 VAC 1.43 mA R/2 350 VAC 1.79 mA R/3 250 VAC 1.91 mA R/4 195 VAC 1.99 mA R/5 160 VAC 2.04 mA Short 0 VAC 2.10 mA"
But a few paragraphs later we read: "(From: John De Armond ( snipped-for-privacy@bellsouth.net).)
Let me answer several questions at once. First, a 15 kV, 60 mA transformer will produce 60 ma almost up to its rated voltage. The transformer is designed to be a constant current device, to supply whatever compliance voltage is needed to push the 60 ma through the load. The 60 ma is nominal short-circuit. All magnetic transformers made for use in the US are designed for continuous use at no more than 80% of the short-circuit current.
I never actually sat down and plotted it out but I do know this: With 1 foot of neon tubing on a transformer (about 500 volt drop), it drives 60 mA. With over 60 feet of tubing on the tranny (more than specified), it still outputs about 50 to 53 mA. That's fairly constant current."
But 80% of short circuit current would be 48 mA, and the current did not fall that far, even with an excessive 60 feet of tubing as a load. So the various parts of this story do not add up. The low voltage test indicates linearity, while the full voltage test indicates current regulation. The specified operating current does not match the measured current.
So I am still confused.
No, it's not! ;^j
-- The Pig Bladder from Uranus, still waiting for that hot babe to ask what my favorite planet is...
...
Hey! Let's not knock the imaginary!
Where would electronics be today without sqrt(-1)? ;-)
-- Rich for further information, please visit http://www.godchannel.com
Oh no, I thought someone was referring to The Phantom's tutorials.
Don always makes eminent sense. I have his Active Filter Cookbook right here.
John
The quoted posts were not as you have posted them. They did not include the "[Don Lancaster)."
Shame on you, Bud.
Don
-- Yes, it is!^)
-- IKYABWAI? Come on Floyd, you can do better than that. Or can you?
The standard English syntax for inserting edited text into a quote, usually to show meaning that deleted context made clear, is to enclose it between said square brackets.
Which is to say that, while not commonly used on Usenet, Bud's quote is proper style. If you read newspapers or news magazines you will see it used often.
-- Floyd L. Davidson Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska) floyd@barrow.com
Quotes in this post have been edited by application of the DERF transform, whereby Dreck, Extraneousness, Redundancy, and Foolishness are replaced with "[DERF]".
"Fred Bloggs" wrote >> "Fred Bloggs" wrote in
solid, that graph shows "freezing" occurring at 273K
You have now demonstrated yourself to be either an idiot, blind, or a liar. Not does the straight portion of that curve fail to reach 10^9 Pa, no part of it reaches that pressure.
on pressure, the freezing point, I believe, is not"
Actually, John's post to which I first responded in this thread, mentioned "sublimation". So, again, ignoring that whole phase change boundary would be silly.
The conversion of water vapor into ice is "freezing". You cannot, by assertion and fiat, eliminate that part of water's phase space. In your typically parochial manner, you appear to confuse your familiarity with one meaning of the word with comphrehensive knowledge. Anybody less certain that they know everything can find several additional meanings, including my usage, at:
Have you ever considered why you are so prone to spewing so much self-revealing vitriol?
-- --Larry Brasfield email: donotspam_larry_brasfield@hotmail.com Above views may belong only to me.
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