Tesla is fast

I have seen it active many times, and also when ambient temperatures are

See plot of lifetime vs temperature here:

If that is the case, the error in logic is that you need to warm the battery prior to charging. The battery would be warmed sufficiently while charging by the waste heat without using additional heat.

In the Tesla, the battery is warmed at the expense of otherwise useful energy, because it shortens the charging time. Time connected to the charger is considered a "precious" commodity since they are expensive units and there are only so many.

Where did you get your data? The graph doesn't even say what type of battery it is for.

Engines stall when a high load is applied, motors burn out. We need a happy medium.

So that's a truck truck not a car truck? You Merkins need to sort your language.

There isn't enough Lithium. We're going back to horses.

No wonder it costs so much to transport things.

I'd love to see that short out.

You know when you could buy Li Ion cells with protection? Whatever happened to that?

There's no reason you can't do that with cars. The underside of a car is pretty much the same for every model.

Yeah, we don't need safe drivers. We need cheap, disposable drivers.

We need to let people make heir own choices. The nanny society is beyond a joke.

LOL! So no rules? No regulations? Perhaps you are not aware that we typically start with no rules. Then we have problems and create rules to deal with them. So now we have driver's licenses that you must qualify for, rules of driving, rules of commercial driving where you are piloting 40 tons of vehicle at 65 mph. Someone, somewhere thinks it is a good idea for the drivers to be adequately rested. Then there's you.

If you charge the battery without preheat, the temperature due to higher ESR in the beginning is not uniform (has not spread out), so you wont get the benefit. When the car prepares the charging, it does so at least

I just randomly looked up Lithium Ion data. They are the same technology, so should be comparable to the Tesla battery

Sorry, why is it not spread out? Every cell has ESR. What is not uniform?

Ok.???

There are different lithium ion batteries. The internal resistance graph is for LiFePO4 which is a less often used battery type I believe. The curves will not be the same for the cobalt nickle batteries more often used. I'm not sure they all have the same curve for wear over temperature which is the curve with no description.

Thermal time constant

You seem to be thinking the heat is not internal, but external, like sitting in the hot sun. Or I'm completely not understanding what you are saying. The heat generated from using the battery will be from every cell. So every cell has the same thermal time constant and very well matched temperatures. It would be externally supplied heat that might be less uniform.

What am I not getting?

The cells at the centre of the battery pack have longer thermal time constant than the cells at the surface - they have a higher thermal resistance to ambient, even if the heat capacity of each cell (temperature rise per joule dissipated) is the same (which it ought to be).

The cells in the centre of the battery will get hotter than the cells on the surface. Since this will lower their ESR it makes the whole calculation even more complicated, because they won't be dissipating as much heat once the core of the battery has warmed up.

Ambient??? What ambient??? These cell are all cooled/heated by water flowing past them. Ambient has very little to do with this when driving the car.

Oh, and the "center" of the pack is of little consequence, since all the cells are adjacent to "ambient" at the ends since they are only stacked one high.

They cool or warm all night, so by morning they are pretty uniform. They are heated INTERNALLY from the current flowing through them in use. Each cell receives the same amount of heat from use. There is very little, if any, gradient of temperature.

No, the cells in the center of the pack do not get hotter. If there is significant temperature differences, the battery pack gets unbalanced and it impacts the performance and life of the cells. There is virtually no extra cooling/heating at the periphery compared to the cooling/heating from the water flowing through the battery pack. Tesla did a great job designing their batteries and this is an important aspect they did a great job on.

Oddly enough, it's the UI they seem to have whacked.

And the rules create more problems than they solve. People are not animals, they don't need to be monitored and controlled like children. 99% of us are perfectly moral folk who wouldn't cause harm. Don't you trust yourself to behave?

That's where you are wrong. Everyone breaks the rules even with the threat of punishment. We weight the cost and the likelihood of getting caught against the benefits of getting away with an act and behave appropriately. I am quite certain that if we did away with speed limits, there would be much worse behavior on the roads and many more accidents and deaths.

The rules may create problems, but most people feel requiring truckers to take appropriate rest breaks is better than seeing more people die on the highways. Heck, even factory workers get mandatory breaks by law. Without laws requiring some level of consideration of the workers, we would still have the sweatshops and child labor conditions of a hundred years ago.

BTW, people *are* animals and mostly do need to be treated as such. I guess you didn't pass biology, eh?

The fact that you are not aware of any of this, speaks volumes about your judgement.