Really? Americans can't do a good job?
Oh, I didn't include the rest of the story about my cousin. He trained his H1B, lower salary replacement only to be laid off. A year later the replacement (as well as some others they hired) didn't work out and they hired my cousin back.
Outsourcing overseas often doesn't work out as well. But many times even when it give poorer results, they keep it because it is so much cheaper.
Rick
t
es
g the mustard. He repeated that theme several times during the debate refer ring to unfilled high skill positions.
You think US students have a tough time paying for higher education? It is nothing compared to what people have to go through in places like east Asia . The H1B visa program is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for many of thes e people who otherwise would have none, the vast majority of them come from desperately poor backgrounds. If the US has the openings then the program should be continued if not expanded for humanitarian as well as economic re asons. Elimination of competition will only weaken the so-called skilled wo rkforce anyway.
nothing compared to what people have to go through in places like east Asia.. The H1B visa program is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for many of these people who otherwise would have none, the vast majority of them come from desperately poor backgrounds. If the US has the openings then the program should be continued if not expanded for humanitarian as well as economic reasons. Elimination of competition will only weaken the so-called skilled workforce anyway.
I want to make sure I understand what you are saying. You are willing to give your job to a foreign worker for humanitarian reasons?
Do me a favor and don't offer up my job, ok?
Rick
't
ges
.
Law is not the lucrative profession that you imagine it to be. The vast maj ority of them are hired into relatively mundane administrative positions at pay way less than engineering. It's no loss to discourage candidate studen ts who would choose engineering solely because of the prospects of a high p aying job. Those kinds are not going to be very good and probably don't mak e a career out of it.
Those damned fraudulent swine have been lobbying for expanded engineering p rograms at the universities for decades, just so they could oversupply the market and lower wages. Didn't the IEEE take on the NSF in Congressional he arings a few years ago over their fake estimates of supply/demand estimates of the engineering workfarce?
e
is nothing compared to what people have to go through in places like east Asia.. The H1B visa program is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for many of these people who otherwise would have none, the vast majority of them come from desperately poor backgrounds. If the US has the openings then the pro gram should be continued if not expanded for humanitarian as well as econom ic reasons. Elimination of competition will only weaken the so-called skill ed workforce anyway.
It looks to me that the majority of H1B are younger and filling entry to ju nior grade experience positions. I don't see trying to protect some loser A merican who has made a career out doing work at that level.
There are sectors of the US workforce where "a bunch of foreigners" have be en a godsend to this country. One example that stands out as extremely succ essful has been the fast tracking of work visas and residency for nursing p rofessionals specifically from the Philippines. These people are nothing le ss than outstanding professionals, they are filling a critical need here, a nd, because of a culture of very strong loyalty to family, have help allev iate poverty in their home country.
majority of them are hired into relatively mundane administrative positions at pay way less than engineering. It's no loss to discourage candidate students who would choose engineering solely because of the prospects of a high paying job. Those kinds are not going to be very good and probably don't make a career out of it.
By that reasoning we should discourage doctors from entering medical school because they won't be any good. Hmmm? I studied chemistry and the pre-med students busted the curve in biochem. Most of them were honest and admitted wanting to be doctors because of the pay and the prestige. Helping people was way down on the list for them.
I have been saying that there is no justification for the H1B program with nearly 8% unemployment, but I realized, I should look up the rate for engineers. It seems that number is all over the map depending on who is giving the number. Very odd. One site says the rate was under
2% as of the middle of "last year" (a Sept 2012 article at usnews.com), but no source was given. Other numbers are as high as 5.1% or much higher for particular areas within engineering. The page that was most disturbing is this one...As of 2010 there were 101,245 out of work engineers not including the much larger groups of "Not in Labor Force" and "Working but Not as an Engineer". Supposedly these numbers come from the US Census Bureau and my experience does not dispute them.
Rick
junior grade experience positions. I don't see trying to protect some loser American who has made a career out doing work at that level.
If that is what you think of American workers, I don't see any reason to continue this conversation...
Rick
The US has one of the highest corporate tax rates in the industrialiased world, but every industry seesm to have its tailor- made loop-hole, so the US actually collects a rather lower proportion of corporate income in tax than pretty much ever other advanced industrialised country. Why do you think US industry spends so much on lobbyists and contributes so much to politicians' election campaign funds?
Now find the data on the corporate tax yield.
-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
s.
sn't
wages
too..
s,
s.
majority of them are hired into relatively mundane administrative position s at pay way less than engineering. It's no loss to discourage candidate st udents who would choose engineering solely because of the prospects of a hi gh paying job. Those kinds are not going to be very good and probably don't make a career out of it.
That's one reason the med schools have admission boards that interview the applicants. The average admission rate is very low, something like 3% last time I looked. Medical school resources in this country are too slim to was te on gold diggers.
There is a lot of information that can read into those statistics. It confi rms what everyone knows, and that is quite a large number of graduates aren 't fit for any kind of engineering work. By definition, in that census, an engineer is someone with a degree in engineering. There's that friggin meri tocracy again, because that is certainly not the reality. They should re-ti tle the survey to American Community Survey of Career Outcomes by Degree. T here are a lot of people in those numbers who are good for nothing.
It's a studied fact that the US and EU have very similar effective tax rates. (I read an article on this (which obviously makes me an eckspurt) but I haven't the cite to hand.) The only difference is, the U.S. doesn't tax it in the first place, due primarily to heavy lobbying ("everyone has their loophole!"). EU countries tax the hell out of everything (the average income tax rate in the US is around 30%, while in EU countries it's basically double, ca. 60% isn't it?), then give back some of it through programs and subsidies. In the end, the government takes the same ~30% or whatever it actually comes to. Oh, and not to mention QE or any of those cans of worms.
It doesn't matter whether it's taken and given back, or just not taken in the first place. The effect is the same: the government gets what it gets. We're all living in whatever kind of socialism you want to call it, and nobody is nearly as innocent (or welfared, or untaxed, or free) as they want you believe.
Tim
-- Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk. Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms
Giving it back via programs and subsidies means the government decides how it's spent. That is not the same as not taking it, or even the same as giving a refund.
-- Reply in group, but if emailing add one more zero, and remove the last word.
t
Congress here is not as innocent as they appear. They deliberately enact to ugh tax legislation for the express purpose of collecting "donations" from industry to support their favorite credit, deductions, loophole or whatever . In the context of more ordinary human affairs this would be called blackm ail.
No, but there are similarities, particularly in overall aspects. Consider government budget alone: money in equals money out (plus defecit..). If money in = 60% tax, minus cuts for the corporations you like, it's the same as the other case, where money out = assorted budget + refunds to corporations you like. In the case of military-industrial and whatever other government-aligned services, the effect is the same.
The rest of it, like where "assorted budget" goes, of course, differs; in general, EU does have more social programs (more vacation, more medical (at least at the moment), more income-related welfare, etc. etc.).
Come to think of it, that aspect would also probably be a lot closer if we didn't spend such a big chunk on military. Although arguably that sector fits into the "favored corporations" part, depending on how you want to cut it.
Not saying it's precise, or even well-definable, but it is a useful analogy. To the tune of say five or ten percentage points of revenue (IIRC). The damn economists can't even come up with numbers that accurate :)
Tim
-- Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk. Website: http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms
Well said!
Nobody is drawing attention to the wonderful humanitarian work that Romney has been doing - providing employment to poor Chinese and Indian workers, in their own countries.
t)
n't
60% is the maximum incremental tax rate on the highest incomes. The actual amounts collected in the Netherlands on average wages in 2011 range from nearly 40% - for the single people without dependents to about 30% for those with dependents.-- Bill Sloman, Sydney
It's impressive how many foreign-born engineers and programmers and scientists there are in San Francisco and Silicon Valley. I'm hosting a startup, ceo from Sweden. The public schools are excellent here, and the guys (and their wives) are making tons of money, plenty to live on.
Many more would come and stay if they could get Green Cards.
That's zero-sum thinking again.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom timing and laser controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators
People who want to see how good they are. People who want to change the world.
People who want to work.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology Inc www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com Precision electronic instrumentation Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators Custom timing and laser controllers Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators
No, they keep it because too many 'careers' of managers were dependent on that outsourcing being successful, so declaring it the failure that it is would cause too much loss of face, so they make up numbers to support it. Try to find a Cadence support person for PSpice in America!
ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.