1. Home
  2. Electronics Repair
  3. Ride-on toys kill motorcycle battery - why?

Ride-on toys kill motorcycle battery - why?

Hello,

Like a lot of people, we have run across a few of those "Hot Wheels" powered cars that use a pair of sealed lead-acid (Type H) batteries, in good condition but the batteries are shot. The batteries are puny and expensive (around $20 even at Wal-Mart). So, I got to thinking: a motorcycle battery HAS to have a better Amp-Hr rating than that thing. I picked up a brand new motorcycle battery for 20-something at the local Sam's Club, charged it and plunked it in. WOW! the thing ran better than ever and went quite a while between charges. The kids loved it!!!

Trouble was, after 10 or so charge/discharge cycles, the run time per charge started diminishing and after a while the battery wouldn't even take a charge. It didn't seem to be running hot or anything. Electrolyte level was fine and everything, too. Charge current didn't exceed 2 amps or so. The same thing happened twice, both with a Barbie two-seater "Jeep" and a "quad."

I am confused. I don't think surge current is an issue, as their primary function is to send a massive bolus of current to a starter motor. Perhaps I exceeded some sort of "continuous current draw" rating? I have an electricity/electronics background, but batteries are not my forte'. I would really like to know what caused the motorcyle batteries to die so I can avoid this problem later.

I really don't want to buy those puny overpriced batteries if I can avoid it. I am wondering, should I go one battery size up (perhaps a lawn tractor battery?) The battery compartment would probably accommodate one of those, but it is too small for an auto battery. (Wishfully thinking I could put a deep-discharge RV battery into it! Wouldn't that be something! (grin))

Thanks much for any information!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Doug the Desert Tripper - Exploring Southern Cal deserts and the Net since '94

formatting link
*Replace 'see-below.no-SPAM.net' with 'dslextreme.com' to email me.*

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- .

Reply to
Desert Tripper
Loading thread data ...

Hi Doug...

The key to the technical side of this problem is that the motorcycle battery wasn't designed to be deep discharged.

The old grandfather part of me would have a great concern with this idea... Respectfully, hate to even think of your youngsters playing with a toy with a lead acid battery in it. :(

Worry about the liquid acid, worry about the almost certainly exposed contacts. :(

Respectfully suggest that you re-consider using them - or failing that to at least not let them at it without constant supervision.

Take care.

Ken

Reply to
Ken Weitzel

Like Ken I had a mental picture of a kid stuck in one of these toys that had overturned - with battery acid dripping into/onto his or her eyes and face and.....

David - shudder>

Reply to
quietguy

You have to use a deep cycle battery for an application like this, a motorcycle battery is only meant to supply power for a few seconds to start the engine, at which point the alternator takes over. If you discharge it significantly it'll sulfate very quickly. Get a deep cycle battery, a sealed gel cell would be the best bet.

Reply to
James Sweet

sorry. meant to send this to the list...

i was lookign up hopping these cars on the net a while ago.. from what i understand people were using trolling motor batteries.

i'm not this guy but i rememeber seeing this cd a while ago.. check out some of the videos on this page too.

formatting link

i swapped out my son's f150 tires for rubber tired with bearings i got from a swap meet. they are 10 times better then the big plastic wheels.

let me know if you get it figured out or want to go half on this CD. ;)

k.

------------

'94

------------

Reply to
Keith in NJ

A motorcycle battery can't tolerate the deep discharge. Motorcycles have to have a fully charged battery to start and run, their charging system keeps the battery at full charge during operation. i.e. motorcycle batteries are therefor designed to give best performance at top cycle with little consideration towards deep discharge durability. You can get aftermarket SLA batteries that match the oem's at any industrial battery supply shop for a bit more than the 20 bucks you paid for that shallow cycle motorcycle battery.

Reply to
none

quietguy wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@REMOVE-TO-REPLYconfidential-counselling.com:

Aren't MOTORCYCLE batteries designed to -not- leak acid when overturned,as it's reasonable that a MC could overturn?

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net
Reply to
Jim Yanik

No. In fact, motorcycle batteries leak worse than just about any other type of lead acid battery.

Reply to
dig154

They do make sealed motorcycle batteries, though you never see them on anything but off road bikes and four wheelers. They cost much more so the makers opt for the cheaper vented batteries.

Reply to
none

Like everyone else has noted, you need a deep discharge battery. And I would go with a gel-cell, not something that will spill acid when the vehicle is flipped.

Here is a PDF file that explains what kind of battery you need:

formatting link

Reply to
James Jones

Here are some details that may clear things up for you. There are two basic types of lead acid battery. Those made to provide large but short current bursts, (car, (auto), batteries and those made for a long sustained power drain, (Deep cycle), batteries. They differ in that the plates of the car type are thinner but of a larger area. While the basic chemistry is the same they all need charged in a different manner. Wet cells are made to be topped-up and can stand a bit of overcharging as overcharging causes gassing and a subsequent loss of water. Sealed cells obviously cannot be allowed to gas and overcharging them leads to a short life. Those cars that have their alternator regulator set to charge wet cell batteries are all wrong for charging sealed batteries. Within the class of sealed batteries are the gel cells and these are sealed lead acid batteries but the electrolyte is treated with silica to form a gel. Now while gel cells are sealed lead acid batteries NOT ALL SEALED LEAD ACID BATTERIES ARE GEL CELLS.

The point is that cheap car chargers, or alternators not set for the job, will kill sealed and gel batteries quick time. Gel cells really need three stage, controlled, chargers. See this

formatting link 

--

Aefauldlie, (Scots word for Honestly),
Robert, (Auld Bob), Peffers,
Kelty,
Fife,
Scotland, (UK).
Web Site, "The Eck's Files":- http://www.peffers50.freeserve.co.uk
Reply to
Robert Peffers

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Doug

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- .

Drop

by

formatting link
for information on what type of batteries to use in various applications and an explanation of why they fail when miss-used.

You need gel-cell deep discharge batteries that are spiral wound...

John :-#)#

--
  (Please post followups or tech enquires to the newsgroup)  John's 
Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9      Call 
(604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games)            
        www.flippers.com              "Old pinballers never die, they 
just flip out."
Reply to
John Robertson

batteries ...

Try

formatting link
instead.

N
Reply to
NSM

ElectronDepot website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.