Who Invented Three-Phase?

"Tom Potter," name not familiar. But then, I suffer from mild "nominal aphasia!"

:)

ion on Tesla.

Read again.

I didn't mention my postion on Tesla.

ple,

table people, who have made many contributionsto society over an extended p= eriod of time,can be trusted more than nuts, con men, charlatans,freeloader= s, etc.

True, but then you're selecting for "Normal science" and excluding "Revolutionary science."

Your point is very correct for the conventional business world. But for an R&D firm or science lab, the core feature is the ability to generate novel ideas. EXTREMELY novel ideas; ideas which have never existed, and which make everyone's jaw drop when they're first proposed.

But Visionaries and geniuses tend to be wingnuts and crazies. PB Medawar in his book "Advice to a Young Scientist" mentions the difficulties of being a lab director, when a fair portion of your top researchers are Bipolar ...they create amazing stuff while Manic, then they tend to become alcoholics during their depressive cycle. They can't run a lab themselves. They need to be part of a larger group.

From the several derogatory stories about Tesla, and from his personal descriptions of his childhood, it's obvious that he suffered from multiple brain maladies.

He invented the modern AC motor, then patented the EM drive system: the 3-phase power grid. Who used polyphase long distance power distribution before Tesla's patent?

Evidence? I mean, evidence of idea theft? On the face of it, patents are for novel inventions. That's the whole point.

blames all of his failures on Edison, his backers, Westinghouse, fate, etc.

Very true. It's a major character flaw w/Tesla. But on the other hand, online I've personally encountered instances of professional jealousy, even outright hatred. When someone sees what you can do, sometimes they're delighted, but more often they walk away muttering, then months later they're lashing out with personal attacks for something entirely separate. The link of jealousy is very obvious.

invest their time and money in some of his projects like the beaming of ele= ctrical power from power plants to users.

OK. BRB.

((((((((((((((((((((((( ( ( (o) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty Research Engineer beaty, chem washington edu UW Chem Dept, Bagley Hall RM74 billb, eskimocom Box 351700, Seattle, WA 98195-1700 ph 206-543-6195

I am sadden to see that my pal "Benj" does not know that:

1. It was the so-called "robber barons" who transformed America from an agriculture society into the richest, freest, most dynamic industrial society on the planet, a nation that millions of people from all over the world migrated to get good jobs with the America auto, train, oil and electrical industries.
2. Henry Ford did more to bring honor, prosperity, freedom, and self respect for the working man, than the Jews who massacred the Russian Family, , co-opted the Russian government, and used Russia as a base from where to train terrorists, and instigate the Class Wars of the 1900's.

As can be seen, Henry Ford, Truman, J. Edgar Hoover, Nixon, McCarthy, Lindbergh, etc. like the German, Japanese and Italian people, have been demonized by Jews in the Mass Media because they took a stand against the Class War instigators. and prevented the Class War Instigators from taking over the American government as they had the Russian government.

1. Although Tesla copied most (All?) of his devices from other people, including Edison, as can be seen by the facts, neither Edison nor Westinghouse, nor any of the other SUCCESSFUL electrical power production and distribution companies needed to use Tesla patented devices.

Observe that Telsa was a con man, who capitalized upon the ignorance of the masses about the new, rapidly growing electrical power industry,

and that he rationalized his working for Edison a few months, then leaving and forming his own company and copying an arc lamp that Edison had patented and abandoned because it gave inferior light to the incandescent lamp, by CLAIMING that an UNNAMED Edison supervisor had promised him $50,000.00 to make UNNAMED improvements to Edison devises,

and that he rationalized the failure of his new company by blaming it on the people who provided the money,

and he rationalized the fact that he didn't get rich off of Westinghouse, by claiming that Westinghouse, who was making millions of dollars from his other devices ( Air brakes, etc.) didn't honor a contract that existed only in the mind of Tesla.

1. It appears that my pal "Benj" also does not know that Marconi got a Nobel Prize for his work in the development of radio, and that Tesla's only claim to fame in the radio area, is that he patented a system that he claimed would be able to beam electrical power from generators to user's by electrostatic fields.

As can be seen from the patents of Tesla and of Reginald Fessenden, who both worked for Edison at about the same time,

Fessenden knew far, far, far more about the emerging field of radio, than Tesla did.

Tesla was more of a promoter who dazzled people with high voltage displays, than a guy who understood physics and electronics.

--
Tom Potter
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I suggest that if my pal William J. Beaty does a timeline of the state of the art, and compares the actions of Tesla with the timeline,

he will see that Tesla was a self-promoting con man, who really didn't understand electricity and the emerging field of electronic, nor the needs of the marketplace.

but was a guy who partnered with a New York Lawyer, and obtained patents that capitalized on the discoveries of other people and the ignorance of the Patent Examiners in the emerging electrical and electronics fields.

I suggest that William J. Beaty compare the patents of Tesla with the patents of Reginald Fessenden. who also worked for Edison during the same period,

and see who was the babbling con man, and who understood the state of the art, and who was the intelligent, knowledgeable, creative inventor.

As one who had responsible positions with four Fortune 500 companies, and came into contact with many creative people, it has been my experience that the most creative people are stable and well adjusted, and that the paranoid, egotisical kooks, generally claim that they are "virtuous victims".

Regarding William J. Beaty response to my posting of the FACT that Tesla worked for Edison only a few months, then found backers, and within one year had a company in his own name and had applied for a patent on " on an arc lamp, much like one Edison had already patented."

Edison arc lamp patent - 1881

An Edison no electric arc patent.

As can be seen, Edison knew that arc lamps were not useful for homes, factories and offices, and began searching for a better light, whereas Tesla managed to con a few people into investing in his company, and after they found out that he was a con man, they dumped him, and he had to take manual laborer jobs.

I suggest that if William J. Beaty compares Tesla's patents with other of the same era, he will see that Tesla's patents are not up to the standard of other patents in terms of knowledge, focus, honesty and clarity.

--
Tom Potter
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Some folks take one side of an issue, and some folks take the other side,

and as my pal Jim Pennino suggests, "kooks and conspiracy theory wack jobs"

try to discredit opponents with names.

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It appears that my pal "bud--" did not understand Tesla's patent.

Tesla did not describe a resonant circuit tuned to some desired radio frequency. He described a charging a .04 microfarad capacitor to 50,000 volts, and discharging the capacitor into a 244 centimeter coil about 5000 times per second, usng a make and break mechanical switch,

and using a secondary coil to boost the voltage to 4,000,000 volts to ionize the air between two coils, and by electrical conduction transfer electrical power by CONDUCTION from one coil to another coil.

I suggest that if my pal "bud--" wants to understand who invented the things required to make radio useful, that he should read about the guys who invented things like the cat's whisker detector, the vacuum tube, and the oscillator and amplifier circuits,

and he should read about Edwin Howard Armstrong who invented the regenerative circuit which was one of the first circuits that greatly amplified weak RF signals, and superheterodyne receiver that made it possible to use IF amplifiers, rather than a series of virtually impossible to tune RF amplifiers. (Armstrong also invented FM.)

(For those who do not understand RF amplification, in order to have high gain and good selectivity, one must have a number of tuned circuits, and to tune a fuve stage RF amplifier, one whould have to have a five section tunable capactor, and have all the circuits track.)

And he should read the patents of people who really understood resonant circuits like Edwin H. Colpitts and Ralph Hartley, who's patents made the Armstrong's superheterodyne receiver possible, and Oliver Lodge who patented transmitter and receiver tuning.

No doubt if my pal "bud--" reads and understands the development of radio and electronics, he will come to understand that Edison's discovery of the "Edison Effect" lead to the invention of the diode. which lead to the invention of the solid state diode, which lead to the triode, which lead to the transistor, which lead to integrated circuits, which lead to the microprocessor.

I suggest that my pal "bud--" compare the patents of Tesla with those of Reginald Fessenden, who worked for Edison during the same period, and see who had a greater knowledge of what became electricity and electronics..

--
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to

Sure it's called the "Hegelian Dialectic" it's the way the power-elite control all situations and make changes they want. You create a conflict. You support and control BOTH sides of the argument and promote them. Finally you resolve the conflict in the direction you originally desired. Potter should know, he works for them.

Names is one way to discredit people because first it implies that if the person is "insane" then they are not worth listening too. And second if YOU are accused of various "names" then you begin to be reluctant to enter into any real debate on a subject. And finally by forcing the debated out of civilized discussion into schoolyard yelling it effectively defuses the discussion where the uniformed might learn a thing or two they didn't know before. Instead all they get is confusion and disinformation.

You see, I thought Potter was simply an Internet Whack Job, but he over-played his hand in this Tesla thread and revealed his true calling. Obviously his blatant disinformation on Tesla is designed to mislead everyone and discouraging them from looking into something VERY serious about Tesla. But what? I'm guessing it is his employment with the government (insiders) for Project Rainbow and possibly others. Wow, would that be "proof of competence" or what? But this is a matter of the UTMOST importance to keep secret. and THIS is why Potter is employed to feed chaff into the wind to discourage any and all from looking into these particular areas of Tesla's life. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain Potter croons.

And I"m sure none of the "whack Jobs" here have figured out Potter's little game. Nothing to see. Move along. Tesla invented nothing. Go study some real achievers like say the robber barons who rule the world. Now THERE are some real men! Don't take my word for it, just ask Potter the shill.

I urge you to killfile Potter and pretend he doesn't exist. Nothing he says will have any true value anyway. Continue a REAL discussion of the facts of Tesla's history and achievements. Do not let the paid shills deflect your purpose. Especially look in the areas they LEAST want you to look. It's what I'm going to do.

Tom Potter wrote:

Ben Jacoby wrote: Sure it's called the "Hegelian Dialectic" it's the way the power-elite control all situations and make changes they want. You create a conflict. You support and control BOTH sides of the argument and promote them. Finally you resolve the conflict in the direction you originally desired. Potter should know, he works for them.

Tom Potter wrote:

Ben Jacoby wrote: Names is one way to discredit people because first it implies that if the person is "insane" then they are not worth listening too. And second if YOU are accused of various "names" then you begin to be reluctant to enter into any real debate on a subject. And finally by forcing the debated out of civilized discussion into schoolyard yelling it effectively defuses the discussion where the uniformed might learn a thing or two they didn't know before. Instead all they get is confusion and disinformation.

You see, I thought Potter was simply an Internet Whack Job, but he over-played his hand in this Tesla thread and revealed his true calling. Obviously his blatant disinformation on Tesla is designed to mislead everyone and discouraging them from looking into something VERY serious about Tesla. But what? I'm guessing it is his employment with the government (insiders) for Project Rainbow and possibly others. Wow, would that be "proof of competence" or what? But this is a matter of the UTMOST importance to keep secret. and THIS is why Potter is employed to feed chaff into the wind to discourage any and all from looking into these particular areas of Tesla's life. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain Potter croons.

And I"m sure none of the "whack Jobs" here have figured out Potter's little game. Nothing to see. Move along. Tesla invented nothing. Go study some real achievers like say the robber barons who rule the world. Now THERE are some real men! Don't take my word for it, just ask Potter the shill.

I urge you to killfile Potter and pretend he doesn't exist. Nothing he says will have any true value anyway. Continue a REAL discussion of the facts of Tesla's history and achievements. Do not let the paid shills deflect your purpose. Especially look in the areas they LEAST want you to look. It's what I'm going to do.

hanson wrote: Ben, as I have said so often, you are my most favorite Yidd here on the UseNet. What you just gave was a delightful & classic Jacoby lecture on "Talmud 101", and a kosher one to boot!... Thanks for the laughs Ben, but don't try to get rid of Potter. Tom is great fun too!

"Let'em sing!... All of'em!... It's a beautiful choir!" ahahahaha... ahahahahanson

PS: To me, the greatest line in the Talmud is: "Don't be the first one to go to war, Be the first one to come home... "

You see, I thought my pal "Benj" was a Jew who was all bent out of shape and was trying to get folks to "killfile" me

because I posted that Jews use their presence in the Mass Media in order to promote the fiction that they are intelligent, "virtuous victims"

in order to rationalize why Jews have come into conflict with all of their neighbors throughout history, and why the Jewish culture was vastly inferior to the cultures of Egypt, Persia, China, India, Greece, Rome, etc.

and it turns out that "Benj" is simply an Internet Whack Job.

I urge folks NOT to "killfile" my pal "Benj" because he is good for a lot of laughs.

Here is a web site that tells how Tesla invented radio and the GPS System.

--
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I appears that Potter has a preconceived notion (based on a bad dream?) that Tesla accomplished nothing useful. Potter has been perusing Wikipedia for "facts" that he thinks support his preconceived notion. He has not been successful.

Potter seems to have a fetish about CONDUCTION. Nobody knew how wireless worked. I don't see "conduction" being more outlandish than propagation through the "aether", which was widely accepted later.

With regard to the wireless patent, discharging a capacitor through a spark gap to an inductor will produce RF at the frequency determined by L and C. The transmitter frequency was not 5kHz.

But that is not what I referred to by "using L-C circuits for tuning". The patent talks about the "joint effect of the capacities and inductances of the synchronized circuits". Frequencies of the transmitter and receiver are "synchronized". L and C are used to determine the "synchronized" frequencies.

It is true that Tesla did not invent the vacuum tube or the superhet or the microprocessor or the airplane or the superconducting super collider. What a devastating critique.

How many radios do not work by tuning the receiver to the transmitter tho the same frequency (instead of picking up general spark noise)? Until recently how many radios were not based on L-C circuits to determine frequency? Back then (and very often now) how many radios did not use a signal between the earth and an antenna.

Tesla was one of the pioneers.

Tesla's patent had the basics of wireless, before Marconi. His priority invalidated Marconi's base patents. It is why the Supreme Court decided for Tesla.

Still minimal accurate information on Tesla from Potter. Just unfounded opinions and wild arguments.

. s

I READ SOMEWHERE THAT IT WAS YOUR MARIJUANA GROWING MOTHER THAT INVENTED THREE PHASE CURRENT BY MISTAKE, I HEARD SHE HAD YOU BY MISYAKE TOO. TGITM

I might point out to my pal "bud--" that I taught transmitters, receivers and radar to miltary personnel at Fort Mmomouth,

and that I know a little about how radio works and the history of radio,

and I see nothing in Tesla patents that made a significant contribution to the development and advancement of radio.

The reason that the "Supreme Court decided for Tesla" in 1943 was to steal honor and money from Italian companies and Italian people because America was at war with Italy.

The America government also stole billions of dollars from German companies and the German people, and from Iraq when America was at war with these nations.

Although Edison and most inventors clearly indicated what they DID NOT claim, and honestly claimed what advances their patents made in the state of the art,

Tesla in league with his New York Lawyer, created fuzzy patents with broad wild claims that would be thrown out a few years later after the Patent office made adjustments for con men working the system.

Compared to Edison, Armstrong, Marconi, DeForest, etc. Tesla was snake oil salesman.

One of Tesla's press releases.

Government blows up Tesla's transmitter.

"Marconi wasn't the only person investigating "wireless power". Tesla's Latest Wonder, from the November 13, 1898 issue of the San Francisco Call, reported Nikola Tesla's claim of being able to "transmit almost any amount of power almost any distance without wires, and without loss". "

What made radio possible was high power transmitters with crystal controlled frequencies, receivers with good selectivity and good sensitivity.

Useful selectivity and sensitivity were made possible by the invention of the vacuum tube, and by the invention of the superheterodyne technique. of which Tesla shows no indication of understanding.

Vacuum tube TRF receivers ( Tuned radio frequency ) are light years ahead of Tesla high voltage spark gap transmitters,

and the superheterodyne receiver with fixed tuned IF amplifiers ( Intermediate frequency) are light years ahead of TRF receivers.

The following web site provides the most detailed FIRST HAND accounts of the evolution of radio. It includes newspaper and military reports on the newly emerging field.

--
Tom Potter
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Potter wrote:

Ben Jacoby wrote:

Potter wrote:

Ben Jacoby wrote:

Potter wrote:

hanson wrote: ahahahaha... That is a splendid comeback, Potter, considering the delightful & classic Jacoby lecture on "Talmud 101", which is an exercise straight out of:

Therefore, I shall simply do like the Jews do, and express my solidarity with my fellow goy, Potter, and declare:

- ---[ Potter 1 : Jacoby 0 ]---

So, is everybody happy now?... Thanks for the laughs, guys.... ahahahaha.... ahahahanson

--- Posted via news://freenews.netfront.net/ - Complaints to snipped-for-privacy@netfront.net

I tested out of a three year electronics school at Fort Monmoth in

1972. After basic I serviced CATV, CARS, and the Weathervision system (including the weather instrumentation) at Ft. Rucker. While there I installed a sound system in the general's conference room and repaired some Korean era RADAR equipment. Then it was a year at Ft. Greely where I worked as a broadcast engineer, where I ignored the 'Depot Level' bullshit and rebuilt the entire TV station. They had waited for over three years for Depot to drag their asses to Alaska to fix things, and the plant was falling apart. I still have the 'Certificate Of Achievement' signed by "S.M. Marks, Major General, USA Commanding, USARAL".

Not bad, for someone who taught themselves electronics, beginning at eight years old?

A couple of the ETs I worked with who 'trained' at Fort Monmoth were absolutely clueless. You can look me up in the DOD database to see that I did serve in the US Army.

From your spelling, I wouldn't have sat through any class you 'taught'.

--
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.

Based on what you write you did not learn much.

Or, more likely, to support your absurd ideas you ignore what you learned.

What made radio possible, like the most technology, is steps built on top of previous steps in radio technology. When Tesla was working in wireless not much was known, and it certainly was not useful for anything.

Among the base steps in radio that does something useful is tuning transmitter and receiver to the same frequency. What percentage of radios do that?

Another is using LC circuits for tuning. What percentage of 20th century radios depended on LC circuits?

What percentage of transmitters at high power and longer wavelength put the signal between an antenna and ground? How significant is 1/4 wavelength wire length?

And how important is it to "transmit intelligible messages to long distances"?

The stupidest argument I have seen in a long time. Congratulations.

Marconi did not understand superhets or vacuum tubes. He understood and 'borrowed' some of Tesla's ideas.

Until ICs about every superhet (including crystal controlled ones) need LC circuits.

You suffer from willful stupidity, a common affliction of trolls.

Oh, and Edison did not understand the significance of Tesla's induction motor even when Tesla worked for Edison and tried to promote it.

Add to the list - what percentage of 20th century horsepower used the designs in Tesla's patents?

And what percentage of power systems are 3-phase AC? (And earlier some

2-phase ones.)

Still minimal accurate information on Tesla from Potter. Continued unfounded opinions and wild arguments.

What exactly did Tesla/Marconi do that was not done by Hertz in 1887 ?

Hertz used resonant transmit and receiver antennas (around 400 MHz) in order to move as much power from the transmitter to receiver. Other experimenters, such as Bose, developed microwave waveguides, cavity resonators etc. before the end of the 19th century.

What Marconi, Ferdinand Braun, Eduard Branly (and possibly Tesla) did, was creating some ways of effectively generating and detecting EM waves at LF in a practical systems.

I don't want to be a Tesla basher, as I think that charlatans and con men serve a useful function by publicizing new technology, and as my pal "bud--" points out, even stimulate ideas in the minds of others,

but I would like to point out that although con men serve a useful purpose that they should not be made into cult figures.

I suggest that if anyone needs to worship persons rather than things and ideas, that they should worship people like Edison, Ford, Marconi, Carnegie, and yes, Bill Gates and Steve Jobs.

--
Tom Potter
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Thanks to my pal "Michael A. Terrell" for calling attention to my typos "Mmomouth" and "miltary".

We had ways of making sure that students showed up in class and paid attention.

I found that pulling a student's week end pass usually did the trick.

When I taught at Fort "Monmouth" students had to assemble and troubleshoot a superheterodyne receiver,

and if Mike learned anything at Fort Monmoth he knows that Tesla made no contributions that contributed to the advancement of Radio,

like stable, tunable, local oscillators; mixers, intermediate frequency amplifiers, detectors, automatic volume control, audio amplifiers, automatic frequency control, etc.

--
Tom Potter
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First of all, I'm not your 'pal', since I don't pal around with idiots. That message in every reply shows you for the fool that you are.

Well, good for you, but I never needed a weekend pass after basic. in fact, I took off for two weeks when the flight school was shut down for that time for the christmas and New years break, on the condition i would be back within 12 hours if there was a real emergency. You didn't address the two lousy Fort Monmoth trained techs I worked with that couldn't do anything right.

I learned that at eight, and was working in a TV shop at 13 repairing radios & TVs. There are several others on news:sci.electronics.design who have similar histories.

You're too stupid to even read the message you replied to. I clearly stated that the Army exempted me from three boring years at Fort Monmoth. The more you post, the happier I am that I passed that MOS test and didn't have to meet you face to face.

As far as "assemble and troubleshoot a superheterodyne receiver", I was teaching that in the 'Electronics 1' class at my high school when I was in my junior year. The school had screwed up my schedule for 'E 2', but I managed to take the class, as long as I agreed to be the teacher's assistant. So, I did my class work, and helped the other students who were having trouble. I also taught a night, adult education class while I was in high school.

Sigh, There are none so stupid as those who've had a lobotomy. You belong on the Antique radio group with the tube changers who think they know everything. Most are decent techs on that group, but there are a few that keep throwing parts at a radio till it more or less works.

It's obvious that you're too stupid to see that you can't have the tunable local oscillator used in the common AM radio without Tesla's tuned RF circuits. As far as stable? MAYBE, on the AM BCB, but at 20 MHz? It required a lot of compensation. NPO capacitors, ceramic coil forms and stiffly regulated power supplies. Of course, these weren't needed in the early days of radio, but you can't see past your brain rot.

If you ever learned anything, it was on a bubblegum wrapper. We know you never mastered opening a "Cracker Jack" box.

--
It's easy to think outside the box, when you have a cutting torch.

Michael A. Terrell wrote: ...

Mr. Potter is a "failed genius". Please ignore his rants, for the rest of us!