Switching Circuit

Have knob and spool..the GCFI "works" as stated (state changes: plugging and unplugging) with toaster. Please 'splayne..

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Also: If you can't get a ground wire to the box, you have no business putting a U-ground outlet in there. You can run a coper wire back to the water pipe taking any route that works.

BTW: I took a GFI apart. The black and white go through a core a couple of times in the same direction. Many turns on the core hook to the electronics. The electronics drives a coil that yanks the trigger out on the thing that goes "snap". The green wire does not go into the area.

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A GFI works by having a balance between the H and N wires. If the balance at the coil used for sensing is imperfect, it can false trigger. I would try changing the GFI. This one may have a little imbalance in the way the coil is done. The next one may not.

Not anymore. Too much plastic pipe, and people being shocked or electrocuted. Check a recent copy of the NEC.

In article , Robert Baer wrote:

As I understand it:

(1) GFCIs work (i.e. they detect a ground fault) by measuring the current difference between the "hot" and "neutral" wire, using a differential transformer. When there's no current flowing to ground, the hot and neutral wires will carry equal-and-opposite currents, and the output of the differential sense circuit is zero... no problem, GFCI does not trip. If there's a current leak from the "hot" side, to any path other than the neutral, then the current in the neutral is less than the (opposite-sign) current in the hot, and the differential sense circuit detects a nonzero difference and trips the interruptor. (2) The GFCI does *not* measure current flowing through the "ground" wire... just through hot and neutral. This architecture ensures that the GFCI provides protection even if something goes wrong with the ground wire. (3) Because of (1) and (2), a GFCI can and does work perfectly well even if hooked up to only hot and neutral, with no ground wire or water-pipe or conduit connection. (4) GFCI circuits can occasionally be false-tripped by the sudden turn-on current surge from a high-amperage (or highly-inductive) load. The differential sense transformer isn't perfect, and a sudden current spike with a fast leading edge can cause enough out-of-balance signal to be detected to trigger the fault circuit. (4) The National Electric code specifically authorizes installation of GFCI protection on certain types of circuit which have no ground wire or other ground connection (e.g. outlets which are fed via two-wire cable and have no alternative ground). One can even replace a two-prong (ungrounded) outlet with a three-prong GFCI outlet, or a three-prong outlet which is fed via two-wire cable from the "protected" output of a GFCI. It is necessary to label it as "GFCI protected" if you use an outlet, and as "No Equipment Ground" in both cases. (5) I can attest from personal experience that this method does work and does provide GFCI protection. I replaced a two-wire outlet (in an ungrounded wall box) in our kitchen with a GFCI, and fed its protected output down to another (inside-the-cabinet) outlet which provides power to the electric igniter on our gas range. One day we had a boil-over from a pot, some water dripped down inside the range, dampened the igniter wiring, and the GFCI began tripping. It wouldn't stay in an un-tripped condition until the range dried out. All of this with no ground wire or other ground connection to the GFCI.

(6) The simple "GFCI tester" devices, which plug into a three-prong GFCI or protected outlet, will *not* trigger a GFCI which is being fed via a two-wire cable and has no alternative ground. This isn't because the GFCI isn't functioning. Rather, it is is because the tester attempts to create a ground fault by bridging the "hot" and "ground" pins together with a high-value resistor... and in such a situation the "ground" pin is not connected to anything, and the "test" button doesn't create a ground fault! (7) I believe that any electrical inspector who is competent to do his/her job, will recognize that this situation exists upon seeing a three-prong GFCI (or protected outlet) which is labeled "No equipment ground", and will use an alternative method to test the protection.

You guys are attempting to discuss this with intelligence and logic. *BZZZT*. Wrong. They already confiscated logic and intelligence with the Nobels to algore&obama :-(

Ed

Sounds strange. Why isn't it allowed to have a light buld share a neutral with an outlet? Running two neutral wires through one conduit doesn't make sense.

If you have the money you could look into proper LED lighting.

I got a 60W replacement for free from these guys:

It is very expensive (about US $45) and it is not as efficient as a fluorescent but it does give a lot of light (about 300 lumen at 6W

-specified- input power). Dunno if it likes cold weather.

That was a mistake. Both were up for the 'Noballs' award. :(

You're always wrong, second edition. I gave you the NEC code showing that it is permitted.

What a blithering dumbass you are, Maynard. If the two wire device has more than the GFCI's rated leakage, the GFCI will trip. In that case, something has to allow current flow. Since there is no chassis ground, it can be through a person but it will trip before it can hurt you.

Oh really..

Why do you think! it is called Ground Fault Circuit interrupter.

Take my word for it. You need a ground, unless you want to user (person) to be the ground for the appliance when it decides to connect the unbalanced line through them? The appliance requires a ground so that the lines in the GFCI circuit will become unbalanced and trip.

I suppose the appliance it self can have a external ground that makes its way back to the same ground the service is on, but would you want to gamble on that?

Now, if you are referring to arc breakers, which are not GFCI. Then I might agree.

Arc breakers will trip on an arch how ever, they are a problem in some environments to use.

P.S.

There are some brand of GFCI receptacles that do trip on a balanced over load. Normally, when it passes its rating for the receptacle.

Take it as you wish.

Practice what you want, right or wrong.

If you are referring to Arch breakers. that is not a GFCI..

Please get your facts in order.

yes,. Arc breakers to trip on a fart in the wind.. and even when you don't want them to.

The ground is not connected to the electronics in a GFCI receptacle.

The idea is to have the balanced circuit come into contact with a ground at the appliance. This will unbalance the circuit..

of course, this won't work if the appliance does not have a ground one way of another.

Some GFCI's are designed to trip any way if the balanced current saturates the core and thus generates enough mag field to snap the latch.

Don't waste your time, Michael. Jamie, Nymbecile, etc., have NO CLUE as to why/how a GFCI works... their ignorance approaches that of Slowman... almost... nobody exceeds Slowman when it comes to flat-out ignorance and stubborn adherence to ignorant positions ;-) ...Jim Thompson

You're the biggest joke here.

Really, no fooling, you are!

I don't normally resort to childish words but!

You are a retard..

Fight with what you know about. At least it'll keep you quit for a long time to come.

From BCHydro The first Para from the FACTS pdf

"What is a ground fault?

Normally, electricity flows in a circuit from the ?hot? wire through the electrical equipment in your home, then back to the utility through a ?neutral? wire. A circuit can also be completed when electrical current runs from the hot wire to ground. Have you ever experienced an electric shock? If you did, it probably happened because your hand or some other part of your body contacted a source of electrical current and your body provided a path for the electrical current to go to the ground, so that you received a shock. This rare, unexpected condition is called a ?Ground Fault."

Read the full pdf here.

For a summary an earth ground isn't needed for GFCI to work as intended. Protect people from shocks.

Thank you, Hammy!

But I'll bet you that Jamie still doesn't understand :-) ...Jim Thompson