Start your own Fabless Semiconductor Company

Looks to be a Hans-Camenzind-like analog array, and you just wire up the metal.

Good for quickies, but the density is poor, and the components are never quite where you need them.

Not really a competitor to custom designs.

...Jim Thompson

Jim, Our intention is to be an Analog-FPGA-Like solution. No we aren't field programmable but we do support a "Quickie" design flow and fabrication. Also we are interesting for low-mid volumes but just like FPGAs in the digital world, we will not beat a full-custom design and we will get designed out as volumes go up.

We are a good platform for analog, full-custom experts to develop reusable analog IP that can be purchased by people prototyping with Triad but moving to the expert's full-custom solution for high-volume.

-Reid

Sorry about the lack of analog block specs on the website. We are moving servers this coming weekend (I hope...) and when switched over we will have our Triad Alliance Member's section up. Inside the member's section you will be able to download a MSSA Design Kit (MDK) containing:

• Primitive Datasheets (OTAs, Output Stages, Switches, R, C, Transistors,...)

• Spice Models

• Spice Macromodels

• Digital Logic Synthesis Libraries

• Analog, Mixed Signal, & Digital IP blocks (free)

If you'd like I can email you our MDK directly in the meantime.

Stretch here ---

If you were a member of the Triad Alliance you could develop analog and mixed signal IP and release the IP in a secure form to Alliance members. You create your IP using schematic capture and our symbol library and our Place and Route software interconnects the primitives and macros with vias between metal 2 and metal 3 (everything else is pre-diffused).

You create a Spice Macromodel of your IP block to obscure the exact implementation and then release that model and IP to the Triad Alliance. This IP can be used by Alliance members to create prototypes and low-volume production units (you receive licensing fee or royalty from Alliance Member) and then you do the high-volume, density optimized, full-custom design for the customer. This way you offer IP to a larger group of potential customers and use the IP as a calling card for your full-custom work.

Also, once you know how to develop IP for our platform we could list you in the Triad Alliance under design services and forward customers in need of mixed signal development to you.

Sorry for long winded answer,

Best Regards, Reid

Process specs? Voltages? fT? Bipolar, CMOS or BiCMOS?

...Jim Thompson

Joining a member's alliance thingie will cause some number of engineers to not bother to look into your technology in detail. There are thousands of new products to keep current with, and registration just encourages us to bail and look elsewhere. I realize your marketing types want to know what the interest level is.

John

John, You are right - everybody is too busy and alliance thingie shouldn't be required to get data. I'm not really the marketing guy (I do play one on the internet). I'm an ASIC designer the past 17 years (mostly digital I do confess). My last 'big' design was a 3D Wavelet CODEC for QuVIS,

All of the technology information will be available without registering or joining our alliance...website update is due by the end of the week...

Reasons to join the Alliance include:

• Ability to submit Analog & Mixed-Signal IP

• Download and use Analog & Mixed-Signal IP in simulations

• Promotion of Alliance Member's services, IP, and products

• Ability to sell IP and products through the Alliance Network

Since we want to have our own "mixed-signal sandbox" we want designers to be able to develop IP and products for Triad platforms even if they are a small design or consulting firm with Triad acting as the market-place and distibution partner. You design the IP/Product - we list it in the Alliance Catalog (website, emails, podcasts, and with our distribution partner), we take and service small quantity sample and product order requests, your provide the applications engineering, we sell you parts at an Alliance member wholesale price and you charge a retail price to customers for volumes 1, 10, 100, etc for IP or products.

Current platform details:

Foundry: AMS, 0.35 micron, CMOS, 4M, 2 Poly

I know AMS very well. Multiple chips processed thru them. Most all of my projects would need BiCMOS... ideally at least ±5V capability.

...Jim Thompson

-- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | | | E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat | |

Agreed! I have n interest in being a "middleman".

...Jim Thompson

(Concerning [

..but the above leaves out an important bit of information, which is the per-unit cost for comparable designs. If you only look at the above info, a third choice beats both:

Full Custom ASIC MS Structured ASIC Discrete components 12-18 months 3-5 months 1-2 months $500K-$2M $35-70K $0 1M-3M+ 10K-500K 100+

Add the per-unit costs top the above chart and you get a better picture of where your product fits in. Publishing charts with no numbers on them

We have 'plans' for BiCMOS...in the very short-term we will be expanding to low-power (on the existing process) and then high-voltage (AMS additive process). BiCMOS is slated for "next year". Thanks for the feedback.

Cool, I'll check it again. Just now we're jamming 16 channels of nasty analog signal conditioning (with power and data isolation!) into under

Tektronix ==> Maxim used to have a very fast analog cell (custom metalization only) process, as did a couple of other people, but I don't know if any survived.

John

Hello Jim,

Other than the product briefs and some converter specs I couldn't find any specs on the building blocks such as the amps.

Whenever I looked at SoC or processors with analog blocks I was mighty disappointed and ended up doing the usual, a discrete design.

Regards, Joerg

S.E.D will send in the Jim T Hit Squad and wait for his comments

martin

Hello Reid,

Thanks, that would be great. Although for now the primitive data sheets would do. That way I could see what is possible with the process.

Email:

joergsch at analogconsultants.com

That was actually great information. Thanks. Question: I can understand limited access to IP. But why would you want to limit access to things such as primitives and process data to members? Forgive my criticism here but that's almost like a car manufacturer not disclosing the horsepower of their newest V8. Then again, IIRC Rolls Royce doesn't disclose that. They simply used to state "sufficient" ;-)

Regards, Joerg

I agree with the chart critique. Part of what I'm trying to do with our website and our the "Triad Alliance" is to create a set of very clear and transparent information...I'm working on it but I've just taken over ownership of the web info so I'll need a little time to help make the marketing-junk a little less junky.

I'm not really answering your question about piece-part pricing but I will post some info about a 6 wafer package including fabrication once my marketing buddy gives me the okay (hours I hope).

-Reid

On Mon, 18 Jul 2005 13:56:27 CST, Guy Macon

hijacked another s.e.d. post. That's the only traffic in his moderated group in days!

In almost 4 weeks, 13 threads were started over there, 12 by GM himself.

John

Hello Reid,

Fair enough.

In the US this could become a real problem. In many states it is quite easy to run a consulting business. Once you start procuring (buy-sell) product though a whole slew of regulations and additional tax rules comes thundering down on you. Most consultants do not want to get in the middle of that. I'd consider a model where customers buy directly from Triad and the consultant receives a royalty. Or the customer buys out the rights. Of course, the verification process can be considered a bit dicey by some because Triad is privately held but I am sure that can be solved.

Regards, Joerg

Hello John,

That's exactly the point. Everytime I looked at SoC or analog programmables I could run circles around their specs with jelly bean part. Sometimes even with an LM324, some BC846 or using logic chips in semi-analog fashion.

Tektronix could have been a major player here but my impression was that they didn't market their capabilities much. Maybe Triad Semi can step into that market.

For an SoC approach to be successful it has to be on par with fast stuff, even with a circuit around a BFS17A. Then there is cost. An NRE might be ok (not always) but it is extremely hard to beat a discrete design that is manufactured in China. Where a dual Schottky can be had for a couple of Cents.

Once I looked at one of my 10+ year old designs. 70-80 discretes or so. Since it's still in production I pondered a transfer to a uC and called up the client to see whether there would be a cost advantage for them. When they told me the cost per board it blew me away. You couldn't even buy a cup of coffee at Starbucks for that. So it'll have to wait until TI drops the MSP430 to 30-40 Cents. And it would have to have an ADC on board for that money. Lots of water will flow down the Sacramento river until then.

Regards, Joerg