some BFP640 SiGe measurements

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Interesting. The high junction drops might be the SiGe, or just the tiny junction size.

It would make a decent 0.3 pF 13 volt diode.

I might make an oscillator and evaluate phase noise/jitter.

An x-ray would be cool. We need a high-res xray machine.

Reply to
John Larkin
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The 1 ma jd's are close to those of a BFT25.

Reply to
John Larkin

Hah! Thanks for mentioning the diode thing, I may eventually build a pulse generator using it, needed something like that for a switch. (Don't hold your breath, it's been decades so far :).

Reply to
Dimiter_Popoff

I want to do a benchtop pulse generator, but it would be a lot of work. It would have to be fast (at least 1 GHz rate, 100 ps edges, 5 volts at least) to be profitable; the slower stuff is cheap.

A fast fpga SERDES could generate many channels, patterns even, but the outputs would be clock quantized.

I have some data on the MiniCircuits SAV series phemts, as switches, if that's interesting. S-params are not useful in switching applications.

Reply to
John Larkin

Am 29.04.22 um 21:20 schrieb John Larkin:

A customer of mine used an ultrasonics microscope, long time ago.

The Infineon spice model has the effect of bond wires etc, separated from the bare chip.

Oh, and 1/f also. What unusual luxury!

And under which conditions the spice model delivers correct s-parameters!

Someone must have done his homework in Munich.

Of course, they are. Some network analyzers can do the FFT voodoo per push botton to convert between time & frequency domain.

Gerhard

***************************************************************
  • Infineon Technologies AG GUMMEL-POON Transistor MODEL IN SPICE 2G6 SYNTAX
  • BFP640 Model in SOT343 Incuding 1/f Noise Model and Temperature Model June 2002
***************************************************************
  • For DC-simulations, the parameter set is valid in the temperature range from T = -25 °C upto T = 125 °C.
  • The AC-behaviour is correctly simulated only at T = 25 °C. In order to simulate S-Parameters at T = -25 °C resp.
  • T = 125 °C, the parameter ITF of the main transistor must be modified by the following equation:
*
  • ITF(T) = ITF(To) * ( 1 - 6.5e-3 * (T-To) + 1.0e-5 * (T-To)^2 )
  • To = 25 °C
*
  • This means:
  • -------------------------------
  • ITF(-25 °C) = 1.35 * ITF(25 °C)
  • ITF(125 °C) = 0.45 * ITF(25 °C)
*
  • If in Parameter Set available set:
  • TITF1 = -6.5e-3
  • TITF2 = 1.0e-5
**************************************************************
  • BFP640
* *.OPTION TNOM = 25, GMIN = 1.0E-12 *
  • BFP640 C B E .SUBCKT BFP640 1 2 3 X1 22 11 33 2 1 3 SOT343_BFP640 X2 11 22 33 CHIP_BFP640 .ENDS BFP640
**************************************************************
  • Chip parasitics BFP640
*
  • CHIP_BFP640 C B E .SUBCKT CHIP_BFP640 1 2 3 Q1 10 20 30 4 M_BFP640 CBEC 20 30 9.840E-14 CBCC 20 10 5.593E-14 LBC 2 20 1.200E-10 LCC 1 10 1.200E-10 LEC 3 30 2.000E-11 CES 3 33 1.800E-13 CBS 2 22 7.900E-14 CCS 1 11 7.500E-14 RBS 4 22 1.200E+03 RCS 4 11 1.200E+03 RES 4 33 3.000E+02 .ENDS CHIP_BFP640
**************************************************************
  • Package Model SOT343 for BFP640
*
  • SOT343_BFP640 Bi Ci Ei Bo Co Eo .SUBCKT SOT343_BFP640 1 2 3 10 20 30 LBB 1 10 0.6962E-9 LCB 2 20 0.6824E-9 LEB 3 30 0.2306E-9 CCEO 20 30 131.2E-15 CBEO 30 10 102.5E-15 CCEI 2 3 112.6E-15 CBEI 3 1 180.4E-15 .ENDS SOT343_BFP640
**************************************************************
  • BJT Model SOT343 for BFP640
  • .MODEL M_BFP640 NPN(
  • IS = 2.200E-16
  • NF = 1.025E+00
  • BF = 4.500E+02
  • NE = 2.000E+00
  • ISE = 2.100E-14
  • NR = 1.000E+00
  • BR = 5.500E+01
  • NC = 1.800E+00
  • ISC = 4.000E-13
  • VAF = 1.000E+03
  • VAR = 2.000E+00
  • IKF = 1.500E-01
  • IKR = 3.800E-03
  • RB = 3.129E+00
  • RBM = 2.707E+00
  • IRB = 1.522E-03
  • RE = 6.000E-01
  • RC = 3.061E+00
  • XTB =-1.420E+00
  • EG = 1.078E+00
  • XTI = 3.000E+00
  • TF = 1.800E-12
  • VTF = 1.500E+00
  • XTF = 1.000E+01
  • ITF = 4.000E-01
  • CJE = 2.276E-13
  • VJE = 8.000E-01
  • MJE = 3.000E-01
  • CJC = 6.743E-14
  • VJC = 6.000E-01
  • MJC = 5.000E-01
  • XCJC = 1.000E+00
  • CJS = 9.335E-14
  • VJS = 6.000E-01
  • MJS = 2.700E-01
  • FC = 8.000E-01
  • TR = 2.000E-10
  • PTF = 0.000E+00
  • AF = 2.000E+00
  • KF = 7.291E-11
  • TNOM = 25)
Reply to
Gerhard Hoffmann

The Early voltage is right around 250V, and the beta is about 250 as well. It's pretty flat with collector current--it doesn't tank at low I_C the way old time RF transistors often did.

Too-slow measurements often show the collector curves sloping the wrong way due to thermal effects, so that the Early voltage might even seem to have the wrong sign. If you do the measurement fast enough, though, it comes in at V_A ~ 250V. That's incredible for a 40+ GHz transistor that costs 20 cents in reels.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Reply to
Phil Hobbs

On a sunny day (Fri, 29 Apr 2022 10:40:05 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote in snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

Does not seem so much different from other RF NPN in satellite LNBs? Millions of those around. ?

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

The SiGe's are just 2x or 3x faster than regular rf bipolars.

I just figured that I should get some and play with them. Maybe explore saturation and switching, and build an oscillator maybe. Can't design with tubes forever.

Reply to
jlarkin

On a sunny day (Sat, 30 Apr 2022 07:33:46 -0700) it happened snipped-for-privacy@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

I was looking at the noise level, very important for LNBs.. Indeed would be fun to to test a few, been working in the garden for hours, did put a peach seed in the ground in a sunny place, wonder if it will grow into a tree.

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

We have a wonderful Meyer lemon tree in our tiny back yard. Neignbors drop in when they need a lemon or two, and a couple are trying to clone it from seeds or cuttings.

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Our side of our street slopes down to the south, so we get sun... when it's not foggy like today. The people across the street have dark dank mouldy back yards where things don't grow well.

These people across the street have a spiral staircase leading to their small farm on top the cliff, where they have sun. He brews beer too.

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It took a big crew and a giant crane to lift the steel staircase over the house into the back yard. The payback in veggies is probably 300 years or so.

Reply to
jlarkin

On a sunny day (Sat, 30 Apr 2022 08:51:18 -0700) it happened snipped-for-privacy@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote in snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

The front has always sun here, but parts of the back garden which is much larger, on the north side, only have sun in the afternoon. Gets better each month, but weather is a bit strange lately can go down to 1 degree C is predicted this week, north wind and dry, usually it if from the west (sea) and rains a lot.

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Yea, I have a small road around the back. Grapes grow in the back of the garden.

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lots of plants on the right side.

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

My plan is not to build something we can sell, it is just for me to use. Could have used it some 25 years ago at least :-). The mercury wetted relay based pulser I put together back in 1994 or so did it, still does it actually (in a housing I would be ashamed to show...). But still, I might put in a few days and build one. The idea is to do two current sources (fast and precision both of them, FET opamp with p-fet (e.g. sst176)) charging a capacitor and diode switches to turn the charging on/off (say 100ns charge to 1V then leave it to discharge at some 50 or 100 us RC).

Reply to
Dimiter_Popoff

But that's all small-signal linear. No fun at all.

Reply to
jlarkin

Happiness is a happy Meyer lemon - so prolific. But you probably need to graft it to an appropriate root-stock. A cutting won't grow happy roots, and a seed won't give you a clone.

For the rats, get a 20l bucket, the tall kind that trades use. Put a bit of broomstick across the top with 3 bits of PVC pipe so they spin. Put

8" of water in the bottom, raise up the handle and bait it with peanut butter. Rats step onto the tubes, fall in and drown. Someone near here got nine in just one night.

Did you intend to doxx yourself?

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We're also on a steep rocky slope, but the block is wide and the rock forms ramps - it's a long walk from the street to the furthest point, because you traverse the block side-to-side three times (35m wide at the back). It's amazingly productive though - we have over 35 kinds of food plants growing. It's better than weeds, at least.

CH

Reply to
Clifford Heath

We did buy it from a garden center, so it was probably grafted.

I put an LED light near the base and that keeps them away.

Well, you just did.

I use my real name so anybody who really tries can find me. I'll offer visitors a beer.

A rocky slope is supposed to be best for earthquakes. Less sloshing, and the houses are anchored in the rock.

Reply to
jlarkin

It's more than that--their collector impedances are much larger, so you can run much higher voltage gain, and their Rbb' is very very low, so their voltage noise is too.

They make beautiful cascode devices for pHEMTs.

A BLM15BA050 bead in the base lead makes them very well behaved.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Reply to
Phil Hobbs

Same. I figure anonymity is a lost cause.

Reply to
Clifford Heath

Especially when jerks want to be cute.

Reply to
John Larkin

On a sunny day (Mon, 02 May 2022 09:42:51 -0700) it happened John Larkin <jlarkin@highland_atwork_technology.com> wrote in snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:

I even have my GPS coordinates in some pictures I posted... :-)

"You know who I am, you stared at thet sun,. I am the one who loves changing from nothing to one" "Leonard Cohen, Songs from a room"

sigs... :-)

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

You're the one who posted your street name and a photo of your backyard. Your Meyer lemon tree is clearly visible on Google aerial imagery.

shrug

Reply to
Clifford Heath

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