reliability of Pioneer plasma sets

Thanks, I didn't notice. The problem usually has nothing to do with the newer technology. It's that the companies involved have not had sufficient time or sales to cover their expenses for the existing technology. It's not until the old technology has run its course, that the new technology can be safely allowed to appear. No company wants to compete with itself.

In this case, the big panel LCD technology is still fairly new. Sales of big LCD panels have certainly not hit bottom. I don't have a figure as to how many years LCD technology needs to be around before being replaced by SED. My guess(tm) would be about 8 years total, so from 2005, that would be 2013 before introduction.

Ummm... there's also OLED (organic LED) technology, which is really bright, but has problems with limited lifetime (about 5 years) and requires better package sealing:

OLED products are here today:

Plasma displays are ruining HF reception at my house. Two of my neighbors have them. When they're on, all I hear on 80 and 40 meters is noise.

It's an odd thing, this CRI and colour temperature. I haven't really been able to figure why I have no problem at all with working under linear flourescents, no matter whether they are white, daylight or warm white, and yet, I find there to be something fundamentally 'wrong' with the light from CFLs, no matter what colour they are. I also have trouble reading under them, but no problem with linear flourescents. Also, the strike up time, and sometimes several attempts at striking of a linear, doesn't bother me a jot, but that brief delay in startup of a CFL bugs the life out of me. Strange ...

Today, I bought two new light fittings for my lounge. Each uses G9 halogen bulbs, so I hope that these are going to continue to be around for a while !

Arfa

Probably because you've been accustomed or have adapted to ordinary flourescent lamps, as found in offices, public buildings, and most commercial establishments interested in saving on the cost of electricity. It does take a while as I vaguely recall complaining about the same thing when faced with a flourescent desk lamp at home. I also recall that there was a similar backlash going from gas lamps to electric. Given sufficient exposure and time, methinks you could adapter to CFL bulbs.

I also had to adapt to reading and working using CFL bulbs. I have a "pole lamp" with 4 screw in lamp sockets. I started with all 4 as incandescent bulbs. I slowly replaced the incandescent bulbs with CFL bulbs. It took about 2 years, but I now have all CFL bulbs, and am fully adjusted to their color temperature.

Dream on. The efficiency police are active in Europe:

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jot,

Wish I had an answer. I have several Lowell "ego" lights that use CFLs with a CRI over 90. You can shoot photos at 5500K, and they come out fine.

Either there's something "wrong" with your color vision (which I doubt), or you just haven't seen good CFLs. Believe me, they exist.

ITT/SEL probably, except for the ones that used Philips or Thomson chassis... But that was for the European market. The North American models might come from a different source. I think RPTV's and Plasma sets were made by Pioneer themselves.

If someone doesn't see it, have them looking at a car with LED turn-signals and compare the result to looking at a car with incandescent turn-signals. They will see the difference.

The stuff is usually just crushed and, maybe, if you're lucky, not treated as hazardous waste but indeed post-processed to recover some of the raw materials.

People keep mentioning car bulbs, but we are comparing apples and oranges here, based on the fact that they are both fruit.

One of the reasons that a car bulb is slow to reach full output, is that the filament has to be made thick and robust for enhanced reliability and failure proofing from vibration. That makes it have substantial thermal inertia, so much so that you can indeed see it hot up. On the other hand, high voltage domestic lightbulbs have no such constraints on their filaments, as they are not going on and off all the time like a brake light or indicator, and are not subject to vibration in normal use. This results in the manufacturers being able to design them with a much more delicate filament, with the result that, to all intents and purposes, the ramp up to full output is 'instantaneous'.

Arfa

All of which makes a mockery of the EU WEEE directive, treatment of hazardous wastes directives, and recycling in general ... Just a load more EU eco-bollox really !

Arfa

Yes Jeff, I'm fully aware of all this eco-bollox nonsense with incandescents, but as far as I am aware, it doesn't affect halogens for which there are no direct replacements, at this point in time. The G9 bulb is about the size of a projector lamp or small headlamp bulb, and nothing else would fit in a socket intended for one. Many many ceiling light fittings this side of the pond are now 'decorative' design pieces as well as being functional, and these invariably use bulbs like the G9 or similar pea types in a halogen format, so unless they are going to render everyone's modern light fittings obsolete, including ones that are on sale right now, I can't see how they can ban this type of bulb.

see

for some examples. (That URL might be a bit long to work correctly from here). The ones I have just bought are the "Dexter" model at the top.

Arfa

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I don't like disagreeing with you, but this is incorrect. You can easily see the "ramp up" of household incandescent lights. It's about 1/10 of a second, and is plainly visible. Some CFLs are (at least visibly) "instantaneous".

Well, maybe the driving voltage does have something to do with it then. With double the line voltage here that you have there, I can honestly say that I cannot see any perceivable delay between flicking the switch, and having light. I have asked a number of people the question, and not one of them has said that they can either. Not that that is much of a scientific test, of course. Interestingly though, the ones that I said that I could see ramp up, are low voltage halogens. So I wonder if the fact that low voltage bulbs need amps through them, to get the same filament power as a line voltage bulb does with miliamps, dictates how robust the filament needs to be, and hence how much theremal inertia it has? I know that halogens run a hotter filament to get slightly brighter light, but you can also see the low voltage ones visibly cool as well, which would lend creedence to the theory that the filament is more robust.

It is not a function of the fact that the bulbs are of a halogen type per se, as the fittings that I have just bought also use halogen bulbs, but unlike the fittings that they are replacing, which *were* low voltage (12v AC nominal), these are line voltage types. They definitely appear to come on pretty much 'instantaneously'.

So, perhaps a US 110v bulb, does take twice as long to reach 'full' output, as a 240v one, and that is indeed enough to be able to see ?

Arfa

output,

I don't know. A 100W 240V bulb would have 4 times the resistance, so I don't see it "warming up" any more quickly (or slowly).

But if the filament is of a more 'delicate' CSA, that might well give it less thermal inertia, leading to it heating quicker ? Based on what you are saying, there is no reason why a low voltage 50 watt car bulb, should heat any slower than a 50w 240v bulb, but obviously it does, as the ramp up time can be very clearly seen on them.

Anybody over there got a photodiode, a storage 'scope, and the time to hook 'em together to have a look at just how long the time delay is? Once that was known, I could do the same here to get a rough comparison.

Arfa

Power consumption. I'd expect more problems to arise if you use the TV a lot.

Graham

Sure, but getting to it is the issue; I had promised to run remote controls near a radio receiver to listen for RFI too and haven't got to that either. Perhaps this weekend; if done I'll post the results and a link to an image file for the waveform.

Michael

lot.

The Pioneer runs surprisingly cool. And it's well-ventilated.

That's an encouraging sign.

Graham