That's no eddy mate, we're all doing circles around the bowl. I dont believe the public will ever do whats for the common good, buying the cheapest one posible is going to get us all.
-- They can have my command prompt when they pry it from my cold dead fingers.
That makes no sense. Employers compete for employees from a common pool of available workers, and they use wages and benefits to convince people to work for them and to stay. Wal-mart can't just decide to pay arbitrarily low wages; they can only get workers by offering them a better deal than they could get somewhere else. I noticed that most of the Wal-mart floor workers were either very young or very old; both are probably grateful for having a better job than anybody else offered them.
Whose common good? Just the people in the US, or all the people in the world?
Once everybody becomes middle-class, imports will no longer have an economic advantage. The cheap-imports-from-cheap-labor situation is just a transient condition. Europe, Japan, and Korea were once cheap-labor suppliers.
Being a low-cost exporter is a positive step on the way to being developed and wealthy. China and India and Mexico are there now; too bad most of Africa isn't developed enough yet to be a cheap-labor supplier.
John
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The very old workers were very likely secure in their retirement or income. The very young workers probably don't have a family to support or a bunch of medical bills. Wal-mart doesn't pay enough, that's a given. But they're big enough that they don't have to. Just like Radio Shack[1].
Your last sentence with the word grateful, is certainly not the way I see it. The "better job" bit is just not true. A minimum wage job at less than 40 hours a week (yes, they are only working 32 hours) is not a "better job." It's what no one else wants, because they can't live on those wages. It's a job that's below poverty level. See
And what really ticks me off about Wal-mart is those damn commercials where they brag about helping the community. That's just a coverup for the damage that they really do. They probably do it because they have been beat on so much by the media, local gov'ts and advocacy groups that they had to do something to not look so bad.
[1] All the 25 years that (at work) I have walked across the street to Radio Shack, and I have never seen any employee stay at that store for more than a year. They're mostly male, but there is an occasional female. They make substandard wages and are given the incentive to sell by getting a commission of a certain low percentage of some sales. That's why they're always trying to sell you cell phones or satellite dishes. I don't think Wal-mart even offers their employees a commission. Go figure.As for your last sentence below, the 'cheap labor supplier' bit isn't the way that some countries work. Some countries export finished goods or raw materials and only to other nearby countries where they have a competitive advantage. They haven't been exploited yet by other countries.
John,
What makes you think they can't just decide to pay a substandard wage? That is exactly what Walmart does to their suppliers by setting arbitrarily low prices they are willing to pay for goods. When suppliers couldn't go that low on goods manufactured in the US, Walmart was very quick to suggest moving the manufacturing offshore. As far as Walmart is concerned, labor costs are just another cost to be minimized.
-- James T. White
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Exactly. Read this article, and look past the political diatribe, to the stats.
I quote: "The average wage at Wal-Mart, which has no unions and bitterly opposes raising the minimum wage, is lower than Costco's lowest wage. Turnover at Wal-Mart, according to the Economist, is 44 percent, meaning it "has to hire an astonishing 600,000 people every year simply to stay at its current size.""
Speak of the devil! I'm watching the local news, and they are showing a piece about the Wal-mart heiress scandal and they say the stadium named after her will have its name changed. See
in message
convince
pay
of
wage?
That's exactly what's happening!! They have more than a half million workers quitting every year!
At least with Wal-mart they're up front about it from the beginning. There are other companies that are not, such as this one.
McDonalds has an even larger turnover, something incredible like 300% per year. That makes WalMart and McDonalds, in effect, into entry-level job-training organizations. So a kid can get a low-paying job there, learn some work skills, get some references, and move on to a better job. Doesn't sound all that anti-social to me.
Really, the market works pretty well, or at least a lot better than anything else. If there weren't willing customers and willing employees, WalMart wouldn't have grown from nothing. The customers and employees created WalMart, not the other way around.
John
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Did you read the part about Costco in the Slate article? I'd rather do business with them.
Dark
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Hey, Rich. Sounds like I rubbed a raw nerve. I'm not the one that came up with this "abysmally stupid" concept, Wal-mart did. And they implemented it, and the consequences have already been documented, not by me but by journalists, in the media. I'm just relaying the sad story, so please don't shoot the messenger.
As for patronize, see definitions 1 and 3 here:
As for my job, no, it's not directly in jeopardy from Wal-mart. Not directly, anyway, but possibly indirectly. Next week I have to bust my butt to get our new 90,000 sq. ft. facility ready, for its grand opening in January. At least we bought the huge bldg before Wal-mart had a chance to! ;-)
Dark
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cheap,
What's unfortunate is that the "doomsday scenario" has already happened. I suggest you read this.
Do you believe everything you see in a television documentary? Or just the documentaries on PBS?
sdb
-- Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com
happened.
just
If you had read the article, you would have found that they are referencing articles in the New York Times, Time Magazine, among several others. Read it.
I did. Very positive! Seems they are a success, and therefore are being attacked by those jealous of that which they can not achieve.
Interesting!
wrote in
several
being
Positive? Attacked? My, my, your prejudices are showing.
You DO mean 'preference's don't you?
Their shares are probably an excellent China play- perhaps better than investing directly, except for the US dollar risk.
Best regards, Spehro Pefhany
-- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
I have. I read it and several of the other articles shortly after I watched the documentary.
So I guess the implied answer to my original question, is that you believe every documentary, not just PBS.
sdb
-- Wanted: Omnibook 800 & accessories, cheap, working or not sdbuse1 on mailhost bigfoot.com
Well, one thing I can say about Watson is, if he meant "preferences", he wouldn't have stuck in the stupid extraneous apostrophe, you ignoramus.
-- The Pig Bladder From Uranus, still waiting for some hot babe to ask what my favorite planet is.
wrote in
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tool.
I think he's trying to push on a rope. Attacked? Gimme a break. Jealous or envious? Gimme a break. More like they cannot (or will not) achieve what Giant Company is achieving by illegal and unethical means. That's what the articles point out. But then he's too blind to see that. I'm wasting my time, talking to a tree. (/ent)
Had nothing to say, as usual!
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