latest XILINX WebPack is totally broken

I recently "upgraded" three of the systems here to use v8.1 of the XILINX ISE WebPack software, and its companion MXE simulator version, only to find that nothing at all works properly any longer.

The schematic entry program, which was already thoroughly messed up in v7, doesn't seem to work correctly at all.

Simulation of old, long-complete, projects is completely impossible, as is programming of the devices.

I've also learned that XILINX no longer has phone support for such matters, and that the "web-based" model they've adopted for support takes much longer ( a week or so, when it used to take a day or two ) to raise quasi-human contact and begin to approach a solution. Further, the last three issues I've raised with their new support agency have resulted in no solution.

Has anybody managed to get this thing to work properly? What have you RECENTLY experienced with support?

Does this mean we have to abandon XILINX as a device vendor?

Reply to
richard
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Richard,

I'm sorry to hear you are having issues with our software. Almost 9000 people have registered for the 8.1i WebPACK and our support volume has been pretty low.

Regarding your issues with getting support, the WebPACK always has used the web support model. I checked and we have no record of you calling or submitting a web case within the last year. Please submit a web case regarding your issue and we will look into it.

Regards,

Steve

richard wrote:

Reply to
Steve Lass

It works OK for me. I just tried it on a large VHDL design and it built OK. A small schematic design was OK, also.

Leon

Reply to
Leon

Just to let you know, I've encountered a problem with the latest ISE as well :

The error described in Answer record 22167 "8.1i XST - INTERNAL_ERROR:Xst:cmain.c:3068:1.158.12.1 - Creating DSP functions" also happens with inferred distrbuted ram, when the address input of the dist ram comes from a register (in my cas it was iob registers, don't know if it matters).

I wanted to submit a webcase but when I login into the webcase system all I get is "Internal Server Error" ...

Sylvain

Reply to
Sylvain Munaut

I've been having similar problems trying to look up an old webcase for a couple of weeks now, and either :

a) can't log in

or

b) can log in, search, and find the webcase title; but when I click on the webcase link: "The page cannot be displayed"

Brian

Reply to
Brian Davis

Depending on your error.. The New XST doesn't respect the older projects. I found that it had rearranged a 6.x project and then generated internal errors instead of not finding libraries. Next is the single file download DOESN'T automatically install web updates. You have to install the first manually by going to the update centre. There is now only one service pack which covers the free and subscription version. These two things cleared up the internal error that I was receiving.

Sim> >

Reply to
Simon Peacock

Sounds like, after having released 8.1, they sent the programmers to the Bahamas or something. ;-)

Thanks! Rich

Reply to
Rich Grise

Sadly, you're quite mistaken.

I've been in contact with the local XILINX sales office and their FAE agrees that v7.1 was too slow to be of any use, and v8.1 is so badly messed up that one can't really do much with it at all. I've gone back to using v6.3.03, which seems, aside from long-standing issues that I've reported, some dating back as far as release 4.2 yet have never been addressed, such as errors in netlisting, etc. The most annoying problems I've encountered have been associated with ECS, but there have been others, e.g. intermittent failure of the software to adhere to Windows conventions with respect to cut and paste, etc, (I could go on, but what's the use).

I've had over a dozen cases, probably closer to three dozen, open over the last year, and certainly quite a few more than that in years past. Only one or two have been resolved in any sense, the remainder having been escalated via CR's, but still remaining unresolved. They're always scheduled for repair in "the next release" but that seldom happens. I have observed that if I don't complain, nothing gets fixed. Of course, if I do complain, there's no guarantee, but I have to go on record.

In 8.1, several major things that immediately impair progress have been introduced. I've complained about that, but I haven't time to do XILINX' work for them. They need to put a few dozen, or perhaps a few hundred, people who've used software to do useful work, and not just to create more software, on the task testing this software against written documents which provide specific criteria consistent with how it is supposed to work.

In release 5.0 (2002) I reported that ECS fails to change line-draw mode when the user selects "manual mode." The workaround is still the only way of dealing with that, and the workaround is to leave line-draw mode and then re-enter it. That sets manual mode. Going back to autorouting mode requires the same set-exit-reenter sequence. Likewise, I complained in 2002 about the fact that bus taps, which won't always align with the line-draw grid. That's still a problem. The workaround for that is to exit ECS and then re-enter, whereupon the bus-tap to line registration is resolved. There are numerous others that work similarly. ECS occasionally reports errors that it can't show on the display. When one exits ECS and re-enters it, they're gone. The auto-increment/decrement of signal names has, since v4.2, been randomly fouled up. Sometimes, when you want it to increment, it decrements, and vice-versa. It's not entirely predictable, but it goes the wrong way more often than not. Since this is their "try it before you buy it" package, I've not bought XILINX software since v3.1 of Foundation, which wasn't a real value either.

Only today, I finally got a reply from the tech support people regarding the v8.1 sheet size management, which I reported on the weekend. When you change sheet size, v8.1 doesn't fully recognize the change. Consequently, as you place symbols, it repeatedly complains that the symbol is placed outside the sheet boundaries, which certainly isn't visible. In order to get the display to reflect the sheet size, you have to exit ECS and then re-enter.

Of course, one could live with that one, but, combined with the fact that some genius decided it would be "cool" to make the various process menus moveable, which doesn't help anything, yet make them so small, vertically, relative to the entire window, in the default that you can't even read title, then hide the boundary, which, BTW, is not located in the conventional place, so you can't reasonably be expected to expand it, and then make the window overlap rather than border the companion menu to which you concurrently need access. Now, I use a

1600x1200 display because I'm getting too old to use finer resolution, but I think I should be able to see what's in front of me when I'm at the default configuration.

Clearly, nobody even cursorily tested the ECS module when this tool suite was released.

There are problems with the associated ModelSim, as well, but I'm not going to describe 'em here, and I'm not going to mess with that complete mistake that XILINX released until I hear rumors that it's working, which may be a while. In the meantime, I'll use the older stuff that seems to work O.K.

Bitching about XILINX software has done so little good that I don't even get any relief from the frustration of having no other option than to switch to Altera. Their stuff isn't perfect either.

Richard

Reply to
richard

The "real" problem lies in that the folks who manage and those who generate software tools are seldom folks who have extensive experience with using tools of that genre. I've often had the unfortunate experience of dealing with software "engineers" who insist on putting in features not required for the product to work as specified, "stubs" for future unspecified features, etc. and yet have omitted features without which the product was useless.

I think a proper treatment for software generators and their bosses would be to lock them in a room with their product and a task assignment, and not allow them to leave the room for any reason, including bathroom breaks, until (1) their work was fully verified against the objective specification, (2) they had completed their task, in this case, perhaps, generation, verification, and implementation of a 2M-gate FPGA which required the use of each and every claimed gate in the FPGA (maybe locking a marketing manager in with them would help, so they'd have something/someone to eat) on a 16 MHz '386 with the minimum of RAM and HDD space. You might as well weld the doors shut, because that would never happen.

What puzzles me is how they can take such a giant step backward. Sure, there were some bugs. Their support people always denied that they were bugs, but they were. Whenever it internally interprets a simple, A=>A, B=>B, signal routing as A =>B, B =>A, it's obviously a bug. They deny it and try to sweep it under the rug, but it's a bug. It just reproduces under the rug and becomes a colony of them.

Richard

Reply to
richard

Richard,

After further investigation, I see that you have entered cases under a different email address. I'll look into them and get back to you.

Steve

richard wrote:

Reply to
Steve Lass

Well ... they've put out yet another (minor) release, and it's still broken. It's been over a month now. I've been focused on ECS, since I like schematic entry, since that's what my clients want. The other parts of ISE seem to be similarly broken, though. There are icons that don't work, the windows that pop up at certain times in what once was "normal" processing disappear and there's no way to get them back, and so on ...

I'm still using v6.3.03 with some success, but I'm unable to figure out how to do anything useful with v8.1.02. Why would XILINX allow such a gigantic step backward?

Richard

Reply to
richard

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