"manual closed loop control" is there such a thing?

I agree that they are probably using manual closed loop control to mean manual control while you observe some feedback variable or variables The control algorithm you use to make your control decisions may be conscious (and either logical or illogical) or unconscious.

Some people apply manual closed loop control, fail miserably, and never realize that either the variables they observe are not connected to what they are controlling the way they think they are, or their control algorithm is completely wrong. This is especially true in personal interaction loops and all superstition.

Semantics. I taught an EET course in servos and noted that some textbook authors used that as an example. You know, cruise control closes the loop with a circuit or a human closes the loop with her eyes, brain and foot on the gas pedal. Within this paradigm, open loop means no control whatsoever (I suppose ... again, all semantics).

Manual closed loop control might mean keeping the car on the road though !

Graham

Possibly just refers to a closed loop control system with a human in the control loop, something like trying to hold the position of a meter, reading some process value, with a control valve. Very unreliable component to have in any control loop ..... would recomend getting rid of the human element where ever possible !!

"misterroy" a écrit dans le message de news: snipped-for-privacy@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...

Ever tried to drive with closed eyes?

That's still manual but open loop... not for long.

A long time ago, I worked for an outfit that had no controls experience but proposed to design and build a control console for a steamship. I worked up a control algorithm for the main drive engine, a steam turbine with an electro-hydraulic main steam valve. I simulated the transient response, in terms of valve position, steam flow, and RPMs vs time (on an HP9100 calculator) and plotted it in nice colors; the dynamics were interesting, given the various constraints on valve operation and boiler loading. We took it to a meeting and made a presentation. An old crusty steamship engineer looked at the curves and said "that's exactly the response you'd see if an experienced operator worked the valve by hand" so we got the job. This was for the LASH ships, built at Avondale. The company, TANO, is still in the marine automation business.

The Wright brothers airplane was dynamically unstable, as are some modern fighter planes. They used experience, we use computers.

John

John Larkin wrote: (snip)

It must have been quite a thrill building that experience a few feet above the sand.

They started with gliders, tethered in the wind at Kitty Hawk. I bet they crashed a lot.

There was a TV show on a while back. Some people built a Wright replica and learned to fly it. It didn't look easy.

John

The flyer was the first heavier-than-air to kill anyone IIRC.

You could play the relevant sections from "Metropolis" - or Madonna's rip off of it!