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Boarding the microcontroller-train

During the past two years I've been thinking of - but never got the grip to - starting to learn how to use microcontrollers. For my next hobby project, it seems to be a necessity to learn so I thought now - once and for all - is The Time To Learn.

The next project is going to be a something that looks and acts like a chess clock, with some few additions. While not completely impossible to do with a bunch of 555-timers and a lot of logic gates feeding some

7-digit LEDs, the system would probably be a messy harness real quick and blocks the ability for improvements. So I'm thinking a uC will take care of all the timing / scoring, and use some external chips (like a 7-LED decoder and the like) as helper chips.

Now, so far so good in the planning, here's the real reason that's stopped me for learning microcontrollers: I have absolutely no idea where to start. Some people say "Go Atmel!", others say "Go PIC!", others say "Go Foo!".

I have googled around for tutorials, beginners' pages, introduction to / comparison between Atmel/PIC and simliar pages, I've seen plenty of "starter kits" every here and there, some way more expensive than others making me confused of which to buy, so I still don't know where to put my foot.

I have 20+ (software) programming experience. Around 1990-95 I programmed system assembler for the MC68000, meaning I have atleast some of the required skills. I think.

So, considering the next project of mine and my background, which kind of uC might be good enough for me? Or atleast for starting out in the area.

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Rikard.
Reply to
Rikard Bosnjakovic
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Add a "years of" after "20+".

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Rikard.
Reply to
Rikard Bosnjakovic

Elektor has a 5 part course, "Elektor Microcontroller Basics Course - Complete.pdf", that floats around on the web.

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Reply to
Homer J Simpson

On Feb 15, 6:31 pm, Rikard Bosnjakovic wrote: > During the past two years I've been thinking of - but never got the grip > to - starting to learn how to use microcontrollers. For my next hobby > project, it seems to be a necessity to learn so I thought now - once and > for all - is The Time To Learn. >

If you've already written assembler for 68000, you're already well on your way. For little projects like you're describing I like to use assembler wher you have total control and responsibility for what happens. I haven't used PICs but quite a bit of 8051 and 6805/65908. I find switching gears between writing for one vs the other is pretty trivial - even to the point of transplanting MCS-51 code directly into

6805. Rename Intel MOV to Motorola LDA/STA as needed and fix the assembler mnemonics and named Motorola RAM location to the names of Intel registers. Worked fine.

As for the 'helper' 7 segment decoders, I used look-up tables to do the decoding in software which also allowed text using '7-segment font' so the clock can be set for month/day in text along with reporting time 'fail' and restore times.

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You'll have fun with whatever processor you choose and wonder why you waited so long.

GG

Reply to
stratus46

don't know if you have seen this or not:

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it may help

Don...

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Don McKenzie
E-Mail Contact Page:               http://www.dontronics.com/e-mail.html

Crystal clear, super bright OLED LCD (128x128) for your microcontroller.
Simple serial RX/TX interface. Many memory sizes.
http://www.dontronics-shop.com/product.php?productid=16460

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Reply to
Don McKenzie

If you're a software guy, then you will appreciate how much better the Atmel AVR instruction set is than the classic PIC. Others before you have appreciated it in the form of a working GCC target for AVR. So if you want to sit down and code in C with no cash outlay, go AVR. If Atmel is still selling the Butterfly board for $20 from Digikey, get one.

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Ben Jackson AD7GD

http://www.ben.com/
Reply to
Ben Jackson

You could download MPLAB from MicroChip and write some RISC code for their "PIC" type (RISC) processors and run it (simulate it) on your PC.

Then you could buy the actual hardware i.e. a PIC and some other components (for a few pounds) and solder them together and transfer you code into the PIC with the "PICSTART" programmer (maybe a =A3100 ?) and try it out.

With your experience, you will *enjoy* writing assembler using a minimal, instruction set, free from redundancy and you will have total control.

If you were to go for a CISC then you should use C and maybe a third party operating system but then you *will* get bogged down in a morass of systemic-setting-up with no extra gain for a small project.

Robin

Reply to
Robin

You could download MPLAB from MicroChip and write some RISC code for their "PIC" type (RISC) processors and run it (simulate it) on your PC.

Then you could buy the actual hardware i.e. a PIC and some other components (for a few pounds) and solder them together and transfer you code into the PIC with the "PICSTART" programmer (maybe a £100 ?) and try it out.

With your experience, you will *enjoy* writing assembler using a minimal, instruction set, free from redundancy and you will have total control.

If you were to go for a CISC then you should use C and maybe a third party operating system but then you *will* get bogged down in a morass of systemic-setting-up with no extra gain for a small project.

Robin

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I would suggest the PICkit1 for $36 or less, which allows you to program smaller flash devices of 8 and 14 pins. I used mine to develop a project recently. I also have an ICD2 debugger tool, which cost about $150. It can program almost any PIC, and can run the target in realtime with a breakpoint. Both devices connect with USB. I even accidentally damaged my ICD2 with a 120 VAC spike, and I got a free replacement in 2 days from Microchip.

There are many players in the market, but it is important to go with a company that can provide good support, and has a large base of users who can give advice. Microchip has a very good on-line service ticket which gives you quick response to problems, a good user forum, and a liberal samples system, all of which are free. Of course, they hope you will be ordering 1000 pieces soon!

Paul

Reply to
Paul E. Schoen

You've everything going for you so no clear choice for the micro. I'd suggest the PICs. Primarily because they are cheap, available everywhere, all the devices are similar inside and every man and his dog offers hardware and software for them. Downside is that the PIC hardware internals are pukey and the microchip manuals and support stuff have been written by lunatics from some programmer's care home. They're easy to use once you've got to the flashing LED bit, though for a complete beginner, the AVR would get you to that point quicker.

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Reply to
john jardine

Agreed!

Actually I think the datasheets are one of their strong suits. If you want to drive some PIC's I2C hardware, you could learn how to do it from their datasheets having not previously known what I2C was at all. They're much better than the ones for the early AVR parts.

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Ben Jackson AD7GD

http://www.ben.com/
Reply to
Ben Jackson

It's the size of the things that scares me. God knows what they do to a new starter. Just starting to use their 128K PIC18F? thing, 8Mbyte PDF, 500 pages, no way am I printing it out. Spent 10 minutes leafing through looking for monumental improvements in line with their marketing blurb. Nah, realised I was just looking at cut and pasted 16F628s or 16F877s etc. Seems we're now upto 80 instructions (very nice!). Think it's high time they lost the "R"isc marketing aspect :) john

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Reply to
john jardine

...

I just find it a little hard to believe that there are people who actually seem to _like_ bank-switching.

Thanks, Rich

Reply to
Rich Grise

Thank you for the input.

There is probably no risk for painting myself into a corner - I could always change the architecture if I see that there's something queaky. But as of the time of writing, I have zero experience with any kind of microcontroller, and I feel that I must atleast start *somewhere*.

I've decided to start with PICs. Ebay had some cheap USB-programmer from China (probably pirated, but who cares) so I ordered it yesterday. In the meantime until I get it, I'll eat some more documentation.

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Rikard.
Reply to
Rikard Bosnjakovic

Check out the Microchip site. You may be able to get free samples to experiment with.

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Ed

Reply to
ehsjr

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