Relay for 74HC-controlled outlet strip

Sep 20, 2007 9 Replies

(Almost certainly overthinking this one, but another case where the wrong decision means more waiting for another mail order.)



A couple of projects I have in mind would benefit from CMOS/microcontroller-controlled outlet strips, and I'm trying to make some decisions about what sorts of relays this might require. I'm assuming first that the contacts need to be rated for 125VAC (or more) and for well over the current I intend to drive (does P=IV apply to AC; e.g., is 10A right for 12500W @ 125VAC?). And I'm looking for either



12V or 5V coils, whichever comes easier.

The drive circuit I often see laid out is something like this:



+------+------> +12VDC | | - @ 1N4001 ^ @ coil | | +------+ | R |/ 2N2222 signal >--------/\/\-----| |>---| GND

I would assume that I should select R to drive the transistor to saturation. A relay I'm looking at has a coil rated for 120mA, 100 ohms. As far as I know, that ought to work, since even the TO-92 work-alike of the 2N2222 is rated for 500mA or so typically.



Any flaws in my logic yet?



Another matter concerns switch configuration. Would it be a better idea to leave one blade always connected (single pole) or do I need to connect and disconnect both at once (double pole)? I'm assuming that the third grounding prong is not disconnected under any circumstance.



The IDEC RU2S-C-D12

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seems to do what I want. Am I totally off?



One more thing: Say I'm running the microcontroller circuit and the relay from the 5V and 12V pins, respectively, of an ATX-style SMPS. Are there any special precautions that need to be taken other than the typical reverse diode across the coil, decoupling caps on ICs, and so forth?



Thankses PSM


Instead of using your regulated power to run a relay coil, consider using a phototriac-output optocoupler to drive a 120VAC relay. It has most of the good features of a solid-state relay without the complication of sucking half an amp from a power supply intended for CMOS.

An interesting idea...one that could easily remove the complexity on the DC side of things.

A 5VDC solid-state phototriac relay I'm looking at has the following phraseology in the data sheet: "No overvoltage absorption element is built in. Therefore, if the G3MC is connected to an inductive load, be sure to connect the overvoltage absorption element." I would guess that a coil relay is an inductive load. What would one use as an overvoltage absorption element?

Thanks PSM

No. The contacts will be rated for volt-amperes, not watts, and at 125VAC, 12500VA, the contacts will need to be rated for at least 100A if your load is resistive. (But, I suspect that 12500 was a trypo and you really meant 1250, yes?) --- > And I'm looking for either >12V or 5V coils, whichever comes easier.

Use X10. The life/home you save may be your own.

Keith

I did in fact mean 1250, not 12500, but I was talking about watts. No lightbulb, appliance, or computer PSU has ever been rated in VA. (This is odd to me, since from what I've read it's VA that applies to AC. Why are these things rated in watts?)

I'm looking at using the relay-switched strip with a few combinations of small items. For example, a pair of wall transformers marked 25W and a toy lamp rated 17W. What's my current per watt at 125VAC?

The single-pole configuration would be

mains

+---(~)---+ | | | O | \ | O | | | | +--[] []--+ outlet strip

while the double-pole would be

mains

+---(~)---+ | | O O \- - - - -\ O O | | | | +--[] []--+ outlet strip

Is there any reason to prefer one over the other? Is one more likely to arc than the other?

Thanks PSM

Bosh. Where did the OP say he wanted to control anything remotely?

Agreed. Bringing X10 into the picture was a complexity and expense I wanted to avoid. A hard CMOS line is protocol-free, isn't as susceptible to radio interference (intentional or accidental), and would cost well under $10 to implement. As for safety, I'm not ignorant to any electrical and/or fire hazards inherent in this mod. The whole reason this idea seems reasonable is that outlet strips already have a big power switch, so what's the harm in inlining and/or replacing that switch with a relay of the same contact rating? Nothing significant, as long as I'm not careless.

Thanks PSM

Yes, I know, but relay contacts aren't rated in watts, they're rated in volt-amperes. Or horsepower, or tungsten loads in some instances.

I'm only calling them "transformers" because "AC-to-DC adapter" is a bit long-winded and I've never been partial to the term "wall wart". But, in any case, that's what I'm talking about--black boxes with transformers, bridge rectifiers, and probably a couple of other things (never actually broken one open).

What general rules are to be applied when determining whether a load is resistive or inductive? Having no formal training in such details, I tend to assume that something with a coil in it is inductive. By this logic, the AC-DC "transformer" (itself loaded with a small electronic device such as a router, cable modem, laptop, ...) is inductive, the motor part of the toy lamp is inductive, and the incandescent bulb part of the lamp is resistive. I get the feeling that I'm entirely off on at least one of these.

That is not only what I meant but in fact what I thought I had said (abbreviated to a single "out" socket). My prediction of ambiguity in my illustrations leaves something to be desired...

Thanks PSM

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