Re: Repost please: $1/watt solar panals.

actual breakeven, owing to all the previously lost energy.

be confusing energy break even with economic break even. I a

in the real world.

down the road,

net energy surplus.

technology.

I thought there were only two cheap bastards who used old car batteries?

breakeven, owing to all the previously lost energy.

confusing energy break even with economic break even. I a

the real world.

down the road,

energy surplus.

technology.

What guarantee do you have that the seller will be in business next year, let alone 15 years from now?

Actually for system you don't really need inverters at all. I use

Vaughn

breakeven, owing to all the previously lost energy.

confusing energy break even with economic break even. I a

the real world.

down the road,

energy surplus.

technology.

And the sun could snuff out tomorrow, life is chancy. With your viewpoint we'd all still be huddled around the fire afraid of the dark. There are no 100% guarantees about anything but your own mortality.

Which definitely contains an inverter, thus, adding cost.

Which possibly also contains an inverter to convert 12 V to 17 V.

This is a good strategy if the 12 V system total cost is less than the cost of more common 120 V (US) or 230 V (Europe) systems added with the inverter cost.

Paul

Ten years from batteries? Not if you actually used them and didn't just keep them on float.

I have heard this story over and over from manufacturers but I have not heard of anybody, actually using their batteries and discharging them each night to a resonable level, that gets more than a few years of dependable usage out of them.

The solar savings would never pay for the batteries, compared to bulk manufactured energy

Post the guarantee here so we can see what it says. Let's see if we are allowed to actually discahrge the batteries and still get our 1% back.

My 120v inverter costs me 130-200 watts of power when the sun shines just to be humming

Somebody has to take one "for the team"

Actually, the 120 or 240 versions also contain electronics, which also adds cost. That said, the 12-volt bulbs do cost more, mainly because they are a specialty item.

Perhaps, but it would be an inverter sized for the specific job and would only be on and taking power when plugged in, (which in the case of a laptop could be rarely)

I do it mostly to avoid the 24/7 drain of a central inverter. (Yes, I know that some inverters have power sensing, but they have their own issues.) With or without the inverter, I would still want a separate, protected power system, so that cost falls out of the equation. The outdoor lighting part of my wiring system is inexpensive because it uses common low-voltage Malibu lighting cable that is made just for that purpose. Inside my home I wire to code, so the expense is comparable either way. That leaves me with the option of converting any circuit to mains power in the future..

Vaughn

Vaughn

Although they are cheaply mass produced as emergency standby lights. And pure solid state LED based units are still more expensive.

Although you really need to pay attention to the current flowing in a low voltage DC wiring system. It takes a lot more of a percentage when you drop half a volt off 12v than the same drop on 120 or 240v.

And to deliver the same power into the load takes 10x or 20x the current on a 12v service. Useful if you are off grid but not so good in winter at my latitude. Not enough winter sun to keep things topped up.

Wind power is a bit better in that respect if you have the space.

Regards, Martin Brown

My batteries are 14 years old and still going strong. There's a pretty good chance they'll make 20, which is their nominal lifetime rating. They're the bare minimum size in the context of my consumption - generally between 12 and 15kWh per day. Only a fraction of that makes a trip through the batteries, which is as it should be for any well-managed setup.

Wayne

Yawn. I built a 48 VDC powered KU band communications system for the International Space Station while working at Microdyne. Lockheed-Martin packaged it into one of the custom rack modules and supplied the modified remote control software to NASA. It was a modifed Microdyne '700 Series' design.

Cheap and long life just don't go together on batteries. If someone actually did discover how to do it, they would own the market in a very short time.

Huddle all you want, around your jury-rigged toys. As far as the fire, you might get that from you overloaded and under designed 12 volt wiring.

Don't tell grandma how to suck eggs. I built my first solar water heater in 1971 (the unit is still functioning) and worked on the first R-2000 homes in North America back in 1973. We built a completely off grid super insulated home in 1998/99 with Hydronic radiant floor heating, solar hot water and PV.

breakeven, owing to all the previously lost energy.

confusing energy break even with economic break even. I a

the real world.

down the road,

energy surplus.

technology.

The manufacturer is likely to be.

Does a low voltage DC house supply make sense? It's looking like it for lighting.

My system is mostly for lighting, with possibly a laptop and a portable TV thrown in during power failures. The "40-watt-equiv" 12 volt CFL's that I use draw 1 amp each. So far, the most I have on one circuit is 2 of them. For minimum voltage drop, I wire my interior circuits with #10 THHN wire.

Vaughn

I'm sure you are an expert at sucking eggs. You do know that farmers kill dogs for that, don't you?