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OT: Greens kick "Climate Science" to the curb

Climate "science" is evidently so damaged that it's considered not good enough to support Environmentalists' agenda:

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"The 20-year effort by environmentalists to establish climate science as the primary basis for far-reaching action to decarbonize the global energy economy today lies in ruins. Backlash in reaction to =93Climategate=94 and recent controversies involving the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC)=92s 2007 assessment report are but the latest evidence that such efforts have evidently failed.

"While the urge to blame fossil-fuel-funded skeptics for this recent bad turn of events has proven irresistible for most environmental leaders and pundits, forward-looking greens wishing to ascertain what might be salvaged from the wreckage would be well advised to look closer to home. Climate science, even at its most uncontroversial, could never motivate the remaking of the entire global energy economy.

"...so long as environmentalists continue to demand that climate science drive the transformation of the global energy economy, neither the science, nor efforts to address climate change, will be well served. "

Finally the truth comes out; it isn't about saving the Earth, it's about remaking the global economy.

Mark L. Fergerson

Reply to
alien8752
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As I've quoted here before, "US energy policy is to maximize demand, minimize supply, and sent trillions to the people who hate us the most."

There are lots of good arguments for moving away from fossil fuels (especially oil) that don't require lying to people because you think they're as dumb as a bag of hammers, because they just won't do what Enlightened Opinion wants them to do.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal
ElectroOptical Innovations
55 Orchard Rd
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
845-480-2058
hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net
Reply to
Phil Hobbs

..and all of this in the face of all but two countries being (at least technically of not actually) bankrupt... The cry should then be "remake Greece"; soon to follow the other PIGS.

Reply to
Robert Baer

But those arguments don't include a massive increase in taxes.

Reply to
krw

You're so right.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal
ElectroOptical Innovations
55 Orchard Rd
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
845-480-2058
hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net
Reply to
Phil Hobbs

We have tons of natural gas, and it's 4/5 hydrogen.

John

Reply to
John Larkin

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Natural gas use in current technology produces about 20% of human CO2 emissions, but it is better to burn it than release it, since methane has about 20 times the global warming influence per unit mass as CO2.

Reply to
Richard Henry

More like 1/4, by mass.

--
John
Reply to
John O'Flaherty

New extraction gets out a lot of gas that wouldn't ever have been released. As usual, the industry is externalizing the costs, just because they can get away with it.

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--
John
Reply to
John O'Flaherty

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Sure, but methane has an atmospheric life-time of 12+/-3years

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after which it turns into CO2 and water, so the long-term effect isn't all that different.

-- Bill Sloman, Nijmegen

Reply to
Bill Sloman

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Canadians? ;-)

Exactly. Big Brother's emphasis is on new technology, but the fastest route (with zero technical risk) is to just use less--consolidate shopping missions, turn down the heat, etc.

John's old mentor Amory Lovins has a website, rmi.org. The Standford lecture series videos there estimate insane national savings if we just used bigger ducts and got rid of 90=BA pipe bends (a huge amount of power is used in pumps and blowers, much wasted overcoming frictional losses.)

My own consumption leapt with a change in circumstance--I sucked down nearly 18 milligores in Feb. That was wild. Now I'm back down to about 6 or 7.

-- Cheers, James Arthur

Reply to
dagmargoodboat

Good piece on ethanol:

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-- Cheers, James Arthur

Reply to
dagmargoodboat

Back in the 1970s, when Alberta insisted on charging Canada world prices for their oil (horrors!), Enlightened Canadian Opinion called them "blue-eyed Arabs". ;)

Shorter commutes, for instance. Mine is about 60 feet at the moment.

Rich houseguests who expected the heat to be set above 59 F? ;)

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal
ElectroOptical Innovations
55 Orchard Rd
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510
845-480-2058
hobbs at electrooptical dot net
http://electrooptical.net
Reply to
Phil Hobbs

Yep.

Above 44 F (!) (The highest tech way to reduce heating loss--with new low delta-T(tm) green technology ;;-)

Hmmm. We're gonna have to tighten up those windows next winter...

-- Cheers, James Arthur

Reply to
dagmargoodboat

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