C.D.C. now says masks protect you

Sadly, this will feed into the denialists' notion that the guidance is being MANIPULATED in order to achieve a desired outcome (said outcome being "forcing" people to wear masks)

The "scientists" have been too easily bent to political wills, in the (recent) past -- so, who's to say they aren't similarly "compromising" their standards, now?

I wear a (homemade) mask when out in stores -- as it is required by local ordinance. But, that's probably less than an hour a week. (I also leave my eyeglasses on to offer some protection to the conjunctiva). I pity folks who have to wear them ~8 hours/daily -- esp healthcare providers and poorly paid service workers!

Despite our local ordinance requiring same, there's no real guidance as to HOW they should be worn, fitted, etc. So, you see folks with the mask exposing their nose. Or, "vented" N95 masks (medical facilities will not allow admittance with one of these!). Or even "(lexan) face shields" with NO mask.

OTOH, after being in the news early on for our outbreaks (AZ), the mask ordinance does seem to have knocked that outbreak down.

Sadly, folks now seem to have concluded that being outdoors grants you immunity. So, we see lots of LENGTHY get-togethers that had not been common, previously. And, our traditionally mild winter weather will likely encourage more of same.

I've been known to ask such covidiots how they wear their swimming costumes - with appendages hanging out?

[Around here, it's reasonably common for "upper female appendages" to be "hanging out" -- thankfully! :> ]

I just think they don't understand the actual purpose of the mask -- and have zero common sense wrt "physics". I.e., yeah, a lexan shield will prevent MOST droplets from exiting your mouth straight forward, but it will do little to stop those from exiting out the sides and "turbulent flow".

There's also the rationalizing: "I'm only going to be a few minutes (in the store, etc.)"

A tiny bit of education could have made a difference (I suspect store employees are better prepared, in this regard, as there is a structure in place for them to be thusly educated -- by their employers).

High proportion of people don't wear them right and fiddle with them incessantly and/or rub their eyes whilst talking on mobile phones.

It is still better than nothing though and protects the eyes from ambient aerosol rather better than a simple face mask will. Some elderly people with poor lung function cannot tolerate breathing through a face mask so a shield is the least bad alternative for them.

Mask wearing compliance in the UK is remarkably good. I can only recall seeing two people not wearing them in store since it became compulsory - and one of them looked like they were probably exempt on health grounds.

Wearing of masks on shopping streets has now reached about 40%. Although it is hard to tell now due to the lockdown drastically lowering numbers.

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Regards, 
Martin Brown

Itches /always/ occur when you can't do anything about them :(

For me one of the advantages of wearing a mask is that it reminds me not to rub eyes, pick nose/ear, suck thumbs and the like.

I've seen more than that, but it is getting better.

I notice the affluence of the area and shop makes a difference. Hence I tend to shop in Waitrose, plus do that abnormally early or late.

I, too, see it as a "reminder" (though I'm not typically rubbing eyes, picking nose/ear or sucking thumbs -- and, no idea what "the like" might be! :> )

I don't wear a mask when I take my daily walk around the neighborhood. But, can discipline myself to avoid other neighbors just by giving them a wide berth.

Sadly, the mask seems to be an enabler, for some -- as if it magically allows them to flaunt all the other "best practices". The same is true of "outdoor activities" (no sitting without a mack in reasonably close proximity to a group of people FOR FOUR HOURS is not without risk!).

For me, personally, the only real "cost" of the pandemic is the increased correspondence with friends/colleagues. I've had a longstanding prohibition on phone contact, here -- yet, everyone seems to have forgotten that and I now find myself dealing with calls from friends/colleagues on a daily basis (where they would have previously relied on email for contact). The cost of maintaining relationships??

I also see a marked increase in job offers from past clients. Possibly because they don't want to bring folks into their facilities (and know that I abhor going to such places! :> )?

Wear-and-tear on the car is also greatly reduced. I don't think we've put 2,500 total miles on the car(s), this year!

"Early" (first hour) is typically reserved for "seniors and folks with medical problems", at most stores. Sadly, stores are no longer open as late (or even overnight!) as they had been previously. I always found it more convenient to shop late at night or even overnight.

Useless or not, masks are a great social experiment. I was hiking in Glen Canyon on Sunday with three female friends (two human, one labridoodle) and observing masks. Nearly everyone on the narrow trails wore a mask, except me and one other guy. But when people collected in groups, on hillsides or in the big flat field, each group was 100% masked or 100% not, about evenly split.

Think about that. It has strong implications to our sated topic.

--

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 

Science teaches us to doubt. 

  Claude Bernard

I think in the hands of the general public who have never been trained in the correct use of PPE they may well be a risk or at best a double edged sword. I see plenty of people fail to obey quite basic separation of inside and outside surfaces or handle them in such a way as to contaminate the inner surface that will later be against their lips.

I am ambivalent about the use of masks by the general public. But I think it probably does explain in part why the Chinese & Japanese managed to keep Covid 19 under control so much better than in the West. Their previous experience of SARS and routine wearing of masks when symptomatic with a cold does seem to have kept their levels well down.

On my preferred metric of cumulative cases per 1M people the graph stratifies quite interestingly.

Belgium - now way out in front after a disastrous second wave

US & Brazil - steady inexorable rise Spain, Argentina, France & Switzerland - rapidly catching up US

The steepness of Switzerland's rise is truly alarming considering how well they were doing at holding in in check until the end of September. It is almost like a switch was thrown at the equinox.

UK, Italy, Sweden & South Africa(S hemi) - middling

Germany - low

Japan, Kenya, S Korea - barely off the baseline

What does seem to be the case is that different cultures eventually stabilise on a specific gradient as they deploy countermeasures.

UK hit 33k new cases today +9k - we are well screwed. That isn't the sort of record we want to be breaking. Fatalities will surely follow.

Allowing for them now sampling everyone with symptoms rather than only hospital admissions we are pretty much back to exactly where we were at the peak of the first wave and with still another week to go before the lockdown measures should begin to have an effect on the case rate.

--
Regards, 
Martin Brown

So, experientials (hiker types) are strongly socialized and do the same as the crowd? There are other personality types, who need the science and nothing more to motivate them. The Donald has misled mainly experientials, if that correlation holds.

Political rallies attract experientials.

On Thursday, 12 November 2020 at 07:31:27 UTC-8, snipped-for-privacy@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote: ....

....

That may not be the best reference to cite.

The author has been dubbed a "cancer quack" and she is an "NMD" with limited credentials.

This critique of her claims indicates that many of her citations either do not back her arguments or refute them.

kw

Theories about masks change often, so most anybody must be right now and then.

Nov 10, 2020

The C.D.C. updates its findings: Mask-wearing protects you, not just those around you.

"Experimental and epidemiological data support community masking to reduce the spread" of the virus, the C.D.C. said on Tuesday.

Breaking from its tentative recommendations on mask use thus far, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said on Tuesday that using masks benefits wearers, which is a step beyond its previous declaration that said wearing masks would only protect those around them.

"Experimental and epidemiological data support community masking to reduce the spread" of the virus, the C.D.C. said in a document that details scientific evidence supporting mask use. "Individual benefit increases with increasing community mask use," it said.

The unequivocal statements are a departure from the agency's previous language, which suggested that "the latest science may convince" Americans to wear masks and that mask use could prevent an infected person from spreading the virus to others. "The main protection individuals gain from masking occurs when others in their communities also wear face coverings," it said.

The agency also offered an economic argument, saying that increasing the proportion of people who wear masks by 15 percent could prevent the need for lockdowns and cut associated losses of up to $1 trillion, or about 5 percent of gross domestic product.

The new document listed several studies that "have confirmed the benefit of universal masking," as well as some observational studies that have given evidence of its usefulness, including an example of two masked hair stylists who had been experiencing symptoms but did not transmit the virus to any of their 67 masked clients who were later contacted. The document also referred to a study of 124 Beijing households in which mask use significantly cut transmission of the virus, and an outbreak aboard the USS. Theodore Roosevelt in which face coverings appeared to have reduced risk of infection by

70 percent.

Experts said they were thrilled to see the change in the C.D.C.'s stance, and particularly the emphasis on face coverings that protect wearers.

"That matters for public-health messaging, because we don't have people yet who are completely convinced about the benefits of masking until they see the C.D.C. say that it also protects you and your family," said Dr Monica Gandhi, an infectious-disease expert at the University of California, San Francisco.

"I would encourage every American to adhere to masking guidelines now that we hear more clearly today that this will protect you and others," Dr Gandhi said. "We cannot afford more lockdowns, but we can do our part to stop Covid-19 transmission and disease."

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Science teaches us to trust. - sw

ary-science/

ited credentials.

do not back her arguments or refute them.

then.

Cancer quacks do have a habit of propagating theories that have been falsif ied or are easily shown to be false.

Valid, defensible, theories hardly ever get improved, and the people who en dorse any other kind aren't right. John Larkin endorses one class of theori es about anthropogenic global warming that clearly aren't right, so his ide as about who "must" be right aren't to be taken seriously.

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Bill Sloman, Sydney

Before masks were common in operating theatres people usually died (including doctors). After masks were introduced the death rate plummeted.

Before Ohm and Watt, etc. people had no idea about how to create and use electricity, now we do because we follow their rules/laws.

Gee, I wonder if there is a connection or is research just BS?

John

Why am I not surprised.

--
Regards, 
Martin Brown