TLV2372 OPAMP MODEL?

Does anyone see any reason why every circuit I try this model in it fails to converge? I tried relaxing the tolerances,increaseing the iteration limit and skipping the DC bias.

TLV2372

  • BEGIN MODEL TLV2372
  • PINOUT ORDER +IN -IN +V -V OUT
  • PINOUT ORDER 3 4 6 2 1 .SUBCKT TLV2372 3 4 6 2 1
  • BEGIN NOTES
  • FOR MORE ACCURATE CURRENTS
  • IF LOOKING AT BIAS CURRENT
  • USE GMIN-1E-13
  • MODEL TEMPERATURE RANGE IS
  • -40 C TO +125 C, NOT ALL
  • PARAMETERS TRACK THOSE OF
  • THE REAL PART VS TEMPERATURE
  • END NOTES
  • BEGIN FEATURES
  • OPEN LOOP GAIN AND PHASE
  • INPUT VOLTAGE NOISE W 1/F
  • INPUT CURRENT NOISE
  • INPUT BIAS CURRENT
  • INPUT BIAS CURRENT
VS TEMPERATURE
  • INPUT CAPACITANCE
  • INPUT COMMON MODE VOLTAGE RANGE
  • INPUT VOS SHIFT WITH VCM
  • INPUT CLAMPS TO RAILS
  • CMRR WITH FREQUENCY EFFECTS
  • PSRR WITH FREQUENCY EFFECTS
  • SLEW RATE
  • QUIESCENT CURRENT
  • HIGH CLOAD EFFECTS
  • CLASS AB BIAS IN OUTPUT STAGE
  • OUTPUT CURRENT THROUGH SUPPLIES
  • OUTPUT CURRENT LIMITING
  • OUTPUT CLAMPS TO RAILS
  • OUTPUT SWING VS OUTPUT CURRENT
  • END FEATURES VEN 5 2 2 REN 5 2 1E12 Q20 7 8 9 QLN R3 10 11 2 R4 12 11 2 R10 8 13 1E3 R11 14 15 1E3 R12 16 6 4 R13 2 17 4 R16 18 19 200 R17 20 21 4 R18 9 22 4 D5 23 6 DD D6 2 23 DD D7 24 0 DIN D8 25 0 DIN I8 0 24 0.1E-3 I9 0 25 0.1E-3 E2 9 0 2 0 1 E3 21 0 6 0 1 D9 26 0 DVN D10 27 0 DVN I10 0 26 0.1E-3 I11 0 27 0.1E-3 E4 28 4 26 27 0.025 G2 29 4 24 25 2.9E-7 R22 2 6 100E6 E5 30 0 21 0 1 E6 31 0 9 0 1 E7 32 0 33 0 1 R30 30 34 1E5 R31 31 35 1E5 R32 32 36 1E5 R33 0 34 10 R34 0 35 10 R35 0 36 10 E10 37 3 36 0 0.01 R36 38 33 1E3 R37 33 39 1E3 C6 30 34 0.2E-12 C7 31 35 0.2E-12 C8 32 36 0.2E-12 E11 40 37 35 0 0.8 E12 29 40 34 0 0.8 E14 41 9 21 9 0.5 D11 18 21 DD D12 9 18 DD M1 42 43 17 17 NOUT L=3U W=80U M2 44 45 16 16 POUT L=3U W=80U M3 46 46 20 20 POUT L=3U W=80U M4 47 48 10 10 PIN L=3U W=110U M5 49 50 12 12 PIN L=3U W=110U M8 51 51 22 22 NOUT L=3U W=80U R43 52 45 100 R44 53 43 100 G3 18 41 54 41 0.2E-3 R45 41 18 120E6 C12 19 23 10E-12 R46 9 47 2E3 R47 9 49 2E3 C13 47 49 1E-12 C14 29 0 4E-12 C15 28 0 4E-12 C16 23 0 0.5E-12 D13 43 7 DD D14 55 45 DD Q15 55 15 21 QLP V18 29 56 0 M19 57 58 21 21 PIN L=6U W=500U E17 39 0 29 0 1 E18 38 0 4 0 1 M23 58 58 21 21 PIN L=6U W=500U V21 57 11 0 R59 23 44 1 R60 42 23 1 J1 59 29 59 JNC J2 59 28 59 JNC J3 28 60 28 JNC J4 29 60 29 JNC C21 29 61 2E-12 E20 62 41 49 47 1 R62 62 54 1E4 C23 54 41 0.1E-12 G7 63 41 18 41 -1E-3 G8 41 64 18 41 1E-3 G9 41 65 51 9 1E-3 G10 66 41 21 46 1E-3 D17 66 63 DD D18 64 65 DD R66 63 66 100E6 R67 65 64 100E6 R68 66 21 1E3 R69 9 65 1E3 E23 21 52 21 66 1 E24 53 9 65 9 1 R70 64 41 1E6 R71 65 41 1E6 R72 41 66 1E6 R73 41 63 1E6 G11 6 2 67 0 315E-6 R75 40 29 1E9 R76 37 40 1E9 R77 3 37 1E9 R78 4 28 1E9 R79 41 54 1E9 R81 52 21 1E9 R82 9 53 1E9 R83 33 0 1E9 G14 58 9 67 0 55U G15 46 51 67 0 80U E48 68 18 67 0 30 E49 69 41 67 0 -30 V49 70 69 15 V50 71 68 -15 R127 68 0 1E12 R128 69 0 1E12 M41 41 71 18 72 PSW L=1.5U W=150U M42 18 70 41 73 NSW L=1.5U R129 72 0 1E12 R130 73 0 1E12 M43 74 5 9 9 NEN L=3U W=300U M44 75 76 9 9 NEN L=3U W=3000U R131 74 21 1E4 R132 75 77 1E6 V51 77 9 1 M45 78 78 21 21 PEN L=6U W=60U M46 5 78 21 21 PEN L=6U W=60U I20 78 9 0.1E-6 C26 5 0 1E-12 E50 67 0 79 9 1 V52 75 79 1.111E-6 R133 9 79 1E12 C32 21 74 3E-15 C33 77 75 3E-15 I21 6 2 30E-6 L1 23 1 4E-9 R150 23 1 400 V78 21 59 0 V79 60 9 0 R155 46 21 1E8 R156 9 51 1E8 R157 17 43 1E8 R158 16 45 1E8 RG1 0 67 1E9 R159 61 28 100 R225 50 28 25E3 R226 48 56 25E3 M48 80 81 2 2 NIQS L=3U W=1000 R297 80 6 61.5E3 E94 81 2 67 0 2 M49 82 74 9 9 NEN L=3U W=300U M50 76 82 9 9 NEN L=3U W=300U R298 82 77 1E4 R299 76 77 1E4 C35 77 82 40E-12 M51 83 84 85 85 NIN L=3U W=110U M52 86 87 88 88 NIN L=3U W=110U R300 89 85 2 R301 89 88 2 R302 83 21 2E3 R303 86 21 2E3 C36 83 86 1E-12 G36 18 41 90 41 0.2E-3 R304 41 90 1E9 C37 90 41 0.1E-12 E97 91 41 86 83 1 R305 91 90 1E4 V115 92 56 1E-3 R306 28 87 25E3 R307 92 84 25E3 M53 93 94 95 95 PIN L=6U W=500U R308 95 57 2E3 V116 21 94 1.25 M54 93 93 9 9 NIN L=3U W=500U M55 89 93 9 9 NIN L=3U W=500U E98 21 14 6 16 1 E99 13 9 17 2 1 C105 77 76 130E-12 R233 78 21 1E12 R334 93 9 1E12 R335 58 21 1E12 R336 94 21 1E12 R337 2 81 1E12 G37 28 0 96 0 6.6E-12 I48 28 0 1E-12 I49 0 97 1E-3 D46 97 0 DD V119 97 98 0.7 R633 0 98 1E6 E100 99 0 98 0 -571 R634 0 99 1E6 D47 100 96 DD V120 99 100 83.5 G38 29 0 96 0 6.6E-12 I50 29 0 1E-12 R635 0 96 1E6 R636 96 100 1E11 .MODEL DVN D KF=8E-12 IS=1E-16 .MODEL DD D .MODEL DIN D .MODEL QLN NPN .MODEL QLP PNP .MODEL JNC NJF .MODEL POUT PMOS KP=200U VTO=-0.7 .MODEL NOUT NMOS KP=200U VTO=0.7 .MODEL PIN PMOS KP=200U VTO=-0.7 .MODEL NIN NMOS KP=200U VTO=0.7 .MODEL NIQS NMOS KP=200U VTO=0.7 IS=1E-18 .MODEL NEN NMOS KP=200U VTO=0.5 IS=1E-18 .MODEL PEN PMOS KP=200U VTO=-0.7 IS=1E-18 .MODEL PSW PMOS KP=200U VTO=-7.5 IS=1E-18 .MODEL NSW NMOS KP=200U VTO=7.5 IS=1E-18 .ENDS
  • END MODEL TLV2372
Reply to
Hammy
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Which simulator? What error message after non-convergence? MOS Models are LEVEL=1 [worthless] MOS declarations don't include AD, AD, PD... parasitics

...Jim Thompson

--
| James E.Thompson, P.E.                           |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations, Inc.                         |     et      |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC\'s and Discrete Systems  |    manus    |
| Phoenix, Arizona  85048    Skype: Contacts Only  |             |
| Voice:(480)460-2350  Fax: Available upon request |  Brass Rat  |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com |    1962     |
             
  What\'s the difference between a horse\'s ass and Barack Obama?
                            Lipstick!
Reply to
Jim Thompson

Pspice.

I got the model from TI's website.

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ERROR -- Convergence problem in transient bias point calculation

Then a long list of last tried node voltages.

I tried using it in a simple current source,and a regulator and it's always the same convergence problems. I know it's the TLV2372 model because I've tried different opamps in the same circuit and they work no problem.

For the regulator I got it to work by skipping DC bias point calculations and setting the IC of an output cap to %80 of it's voltage.

Yes I think that is why an LDO I built didnt perform to simulation. According to the simulations the regulator should have had 450KHz BW and 60 deg PM ,3 us recovery time but in the real world it took some fiddling just to get 10 uS recovery time. I think it is mainly due to the FET model not being accuarate enough. There is a good paper on it here

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Reply to
Hammy

I'm up to my ears in a project right now. But if I get a free moment I'll paste your model into my LoopGain and LoopPhase checker and see what I get.

...Jim Thompson

--
| James E.Thompson, P.E.                           |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations, Inc.                         |     et      |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC\'s and Discrete Systems  |    manus    |
| Phoenix, Arizona  85048    Skype: Contacts Only  |             |
| Voice:(480)460-2350  Fax: Available upon request |  Brass Rat  |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com |    1962     |
             
 The difference between a horse\'s asshole & Bill Sloman\'s mouth?
                            Lipstick!
I\'ll leave it to your imagination which orifice has the lipstick!
Reply to
Jim Thompson

Took me all of 5 minutes to paste your post into a library, and run a simulation. Converged about as fast as I can blink and has a 77° phase margin.

Maybe you should post your schematic?

...Jim Thompson

--
| James E.Thompson, P.E.                           |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations, Inc.                         |     et      |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC\'s and Discrete Systems  |    manus    |
| Phoenix, Arizona  85048    Skype: Contacts Only  |             |
| Voice:(480)460-2350  Fax: Available upon request |  Brass Rat  |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com |    1962     |
             
On September 11, around 6AM, seven years ago, 4 telephone calls in
rapid succession, "Mom, Where\'s Dad, Is he flying?"
My wife woke me and turned on the television.
****
We will NEVER forget!
We WILL get even!
Reply to
Jim Thompson

[snip]

Another thought... My 5-pin Op-Amp symbol has pin-order...

IN+ IN- OUT VP VN

so I rearranged the order when I pasted into my library.

MAKE SURE you don't simply have a pin-order issue!

...Jim Thompson

-- | James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens | | Analog Innovations, Inc. | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at

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| 1962 | On September 11, around 6AM, seven years ago, 4 telephone calls in rapid succession, "Mom, Where's Dad, Is he flying?" My wife woke me and turned on the television.

**** We will NEVER forget! We WILL get even!
Reply to
Jim Thompson

Well dont I feel like an idiot! Thats what it was.

Thanks Jim

Reply to
Hammy

The reason I know all the answers is because I've made all the same mistakes ;-)

...Jim Thompson

--
| James E.Thompson, P.E.                           |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations, Inc.                         |     et      |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC\'s and Discrete Systems  |    manus    |
| Phoenix, Arizona  85048    Skype: Contacts Only  |             |
| Voice:(480)460-2350  Fax: Available upon request |  Brass Rat  |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com |    1962     |
             
 I love to cook with wine     Sometimes I even put it in the food
Reply to
Jim Thompson

"Hammy" kirjoitti viestissä: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...

I tried the model in SIMetrix. Did fine in AC and DC analysis but in transient analysis did not converge.

Leo

Reply to
Leo Sahlsten

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