Use of stepped sine wave UPS with SONY Bracia Flat Panel LCD TV

Why? Is it absolutely critical that you be able to watch TV during a power outage? Is your life so tightly tied up with the Simpsons that you cannot spare a few minutes without television?

These are offline units, so normally they produce whatever power is going into them. You only get the ugly waveform when the power goes out and the switch modes.

My suspicion is that when the UPS kicks in, you will have vast amounts of noise, both on video and audio.

Also, a UPS is not the right tool for dealing with brownouts. Consider using a ferroresonant regulator instead. C&H Sales always has some surplus at reasonable prices. Be sure to load the thing to at least half the maximum rated load for it to regulate properly, though.

--scott

--
"C'est un Nagra.  C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

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Please reread my post and reply after you kick the caffe>**THE-RFI-EMI-GUY** wrote:

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My comments below:

Scott Dorsey wrote:

NO. I don't want the set damaged from periodic outages, frequent here in Florida. Some times power coming on and off, up or down in several cycles.

That is fine, the "ugly waveform" during the brownout is my issue.

Again re-read the post. I don't care if the audio gets noisy or the video shows an artifact as long as nothing gets damaged.

On Sat, 23 Dec 2006 15:02:56 -0500, **THE-RFI-EMI-GUY** Has Frothed:

Been running a Panasonic 51" rear projection on an APC 1500 for a few years. Also run my DirecTV DVR on it. Did this after getting fed up with power interruptions that have since been fixed. I don't notice any problems with my equipment.

--
Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook, Line & Sinker, June 2004

COOSN-266-06-25794

They will actually ride out a drop out for several cycles... as many as ten on some of the bigger ones.

Or do you actually have outages, and not just brownouts?

--scott

Please shut off the HTML encoding.

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"C'est un Nagra.  C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

Joe, It would be hard to trust any answer you get. The situation is confused because the typical computer power supply is very tough, and that's what these things are made for. It would help if we knew why Sony doesn't want you to pull the plug. Some Japanese gear store the operational status of the equipment in flash rom. A consequence of this very poor practice is that there have been a few cases where the firmware could be corrupted by power outages. On the other hand, if they don't want you to pull the plug because the power supply itself is vulnerable, more care would be required in selection of a backup supply. I would first get more information from Sony technical support, and then repost if necessary.

Regards, Bob Morein Dresher, PA (215) 646-4894

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Thanks; I assume the APC1500 is stepped S>On Sat, 23 Dec 2006 15:02:56 -0500, **THE-RFI-EMI-GUY** Has Frothed:

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Thanks; I assume the APC1500 is stepped sinewave? Also good idea about the cable box. Mine is a DVR with a harddrive.

I should clarify that these are not brown outs but are repeated blackouts as the power utility trys and fails to auotomatically reclose its breakers. This results in an OFF/ON/OFF/ON/OFF cycle.

Meat Plow wrote:

On Sat, 23 Dec 2006 16:17:58 -0500, **THE-RFI-EMI-GUY** Has Frothed:

Yep.

--
Pierre Salinger Memorial Hook, Line & Sinker, June 2004

COOSN-266-06-25794

To deal with that sort of thing, I have just hooked up a relay so that it turns off at the first drop, and then you can manually re-enable it after the power is reliable again. If you aren't home at the time, no harm/no foul.

Trying to use a UPS to work around this just seems like a worse idea than doing nothing.

PLEASE TURN OFF THE HTML FORMATTING!!!!! YOU ARE POSTING TO ASCII, PLAIN-TEXT NEWS- GROUPS.

When I lost power in the big windstorm last week it was in the middle of my weekly movie night gathering. I hooked the RPTV, reciever and DVD player to a cheap inverter connected to the car and we watched the rest of the movie and another one after that. I noticed no difference in performance at all, the only effect was the 60Hz power transformer in the reciever emitted a buzzing sound, the sound from the speakers was clean as always.

Computers run fine off cheap UPS's and inverters and most modern equipment has very similar switchmode power supplies. Give it a try, but chances are it'll work just fine.

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Joe,

The APC Back-UPS 650, IIRC, does not have any protection for cable, sat, = or other lines. I would use a surge suppressor which shuts off with = undervoltage and bette surge suppression befor using this. We have = found that it is very important to have all incoming lines protected. A = good choice with over/under-voltage protection would be one of the = Panamax M8CEX units. A good cheap unit without the undervoltage = protection but similar surge protection is the CyberPower 1090.

I would not be concerned about low voltage. The damage is usually done = when it surges back on. Good solid surge suppressors and good grounding = with all incoming lines protected and properly grounded is adequate, = IME, which is considerable here in Gainesville, FL. The idea that = keeping the fans running on the lamp based units is critical is very = much overstated, BTW. We specifically do not use UPS on most of our = systems and have no problems. We do use good basic surge suppression on = all lines.

Leonard=20

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Thanks Le> Joe,

Thanks!

--
Joe Leikhim K4SAT
"The RFI-EMI-GUY"©

"Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason."

"Follow The Money"  ;-P

Thanks!

--
Joe Leikhim K4SAT
"The RFI-EMI-GUY"©

"Treason doth never prosper: what's the reason?
For if it prosper, none dare call it treason."

"Follow The Money"  ;-P

I thought it was against the law to admit in public that you live in Ovideo? ;-)

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prove it.
Member of DAV #85.

Michael A. Terrell
Central Florida

You may want to consider UPS's designed for audio systems, or a higher- end UPS such as APC's Smart-UPS series which output true sine-wave. The drawback might be some noise. I had one for awhile, but it would make a chirp sound occasionally, even when I disconnected the beeper!! I assume it was some electronic component vibrating.

It's about $310 list for a 750VA model (about 500W), and $460 for 1000 VA (700w).

I should mention I have a BackUPS ES 725 on my system (current version is the ES 750). My TV is a CRT and is NOT on the battery backup section (4 outlets are backed up, 4 are not.) I have the cable box (Motorola DCT-6412) and DVD player on the battery side.

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| I have just bought a new Sony Bravia 46S2010 LCD TV. The operations | manual warns against pulling the AC plug without first turning off the | TV. - No problem, I would like to run the TV and my Pioneer 300 disc | PD-F1007 Jukebox CD changer* from a UPS

IMHO, this is sufficient mis-feature to urge others to not buy such a product. Sony needs to re-hire some decent design engineers.

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| Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org)  /  Do not send to the address below |
| first name lower case at ipal.net   /  spamtrap-2006-12-25-0851@ipal.net |
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In alt.engineering.electrical Scott Dorsey wrote: | **THE-RFI-EMI-GUY** wrote: |>Hi; |>I have just bought a new Sony Bravia 46S2010 LCD TV. The operations |>manual warns against pulling the AC plug without first turning off the |>TV. - No problem, I would like to run the TV and my Pioneer 300 disc |>PD-F1007 Jukebox CD changer* from a UPS | | Why? Is it absolutely critical that you be able to watch TV during a | power outage? Is your life so tightly tied up with the Simpsons that | you cannot spare a few minutes without television?

If the power goes out, that's the same effect as pulling the plug. He might have the TV on when the power goes out. I don't know what is screwed up in that TV design that requires this, but something certainly is. But I believe he's trying to find a workaround by having a UPS that gives up a time window to turn the TV off properly.

Perhaps the beast is running Windows based software inside in which case it could fail to restart properly upon power resumption. Or it could be from any number of other bad design decisions.

I have already noticed that some some DVD players that remember where on the DVD you currently are at if you turn the player off with the power button fail to do that if you just unplug it. Bad design, but given the limitations of flash memory, they certainly don't want to be saving the current position every second. With proper power supply design, however, the CPU and flash memory can remain powered long enough when the mains power source goes out to complete a flash save. They apparently don't want to design that.

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| Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org)  /  Do not send to the address below |
| first name lower case at ipal.net   /  spamtrap-2006-12-25-0854@ipal.net |
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