Battery charge tests - running a battery to 0 frequently - checking re-charge times

I have.

No, this is just an industrial sized fast charger, intended to be used on garages to give enough charge in 10 minutes to a battery so that it can start the car and the client leaves. The client is told he has to replace the battery soon.

It is brutal.

It pushes the 12v battery up to 20 or 30 volts.

The instructions specifically say to disconnect the battery from the car. It is obvious, 20 volts can destroy the car electronics.

This is not done on a good battery.

And yes, I have seen this with my own eyes. You will not easily find it on google.

where have you heard that?

citations required.

what is the make/model of this mythical charger?

it can be. fast charging is harsher on the battery than slow charging, but sometimes it's needed in an emergency. it should not be used routinely.

no it doesn't, since 20-30v will destroy a 12v lead acid battery.

you are confusing volts with amps.

fast chargers supply 20-30 *amps* to rapidly charge a car battery. not volts.

many of them can supply more than that, most of which can also supply significantly higher currents to start the vehicle (not to recharge).

car repair shops have something similar to these:

it will also destroy the battery.

because good batteries do not need to be recharged.

because what you describe is wrong.

otherwise, it would easily be found with a search.

UPDATE

Since I've tentatively concluded, much to my chagrin, that Android did, indeed, completely wipe out _hundreds_ of apps (zoom among them), perhaps because they were GSF apps which didn't like that I changed the supposedly permanent unique GSF ID tracking identification number...

I decided to _install_ Zoom (which was easily enough done) and then run the adb commands again to see where it put stuff as an added learning effort.

This is where Zoom seems to have installed on Android:

But something is wrong with my Windows dir /s/a/l/on/b since it didn't find the installed zoom location for some unknown-to-me-as-yet reason.

All it found were six new lines (all of which is the saved APK only). C:\> findstr /i /r /c:"^.*zoom" android_filesystem.txt z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings\.651004.download-complete z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings\651004

z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings\651004\config.arm64_v8a.apk z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings\651004\config.xhdpi.apk

z:\aurora\store\downloads\us.zoom.videomeetings\651004\us.zoom.videomeetings.apk

Since this experiment of adding just one app is rarely done, here are the file size differences between Android minus Zoom and Android with Zoom just now. C:\> adb shell pm list packages -f -s > sys_package_location.txt (390L ->

In summary, it does appear that migrating from Android 11 to Android 12 actually deleted hundreds of apps, among them zoom, where there's no trace of those apps on Android after the upgrade other than the Nova launcher saved their location in the well-organized homescreen hierarchy.

Hence re-installing those hundreds of apps is trivial simply because just tapping on the apps opens up the FOSS google play client to install the latest version off the Google Play Store repository - or - I can just as easily slide the APK from Windows over to Android - or - I can just tap on the saved APK on Android (if I had happened to save it there).

I haven't conclusively proven anything yet as to why the migration of Android 11 to Android 12 wiped out hundreds of apps, but I suspect it was simply that the GSF apps misbehaved when they found out that I had changed the supposedly permanent GSF ID.

UPDATE:

I learn more about computers by breaking the rules than by following them.

1. It's (only?) GSF apps that are gone after upgrading Android 11 to 12
2. It may be due to the fact I changed the supposedly permanent GSF ID
3. Luckily Nova knows (almost) exactly how to point to the app installer
4. However it's a mystery _how_ Nova knows (almost) exactly which it is
5. Given the app appears to otherwise be wiped completely off the map
6. However Windows, for some reason, doesn't _find_ the installed app
7. And yet, adb on Windows can easily find that newly installed app

The main questions that need to be resolved are a. Why can't Windows "dir" find the installed app when Windows adb can? b. How does Nova launcher know exactly which app was wiped off the phone? c. Why should Android upgrades even care about the GSF ID?

Bear in mind there's almost no effort whatsoever in re-installing the hundreds of missing apps; all the effort is going into trying to figure out _why_ and _how_ that happened (as a lot of "magic" seems to have occurred).

Every disaster is an opportunity to learn, where, so far, as I'm going slowly since it's something I look at when I need an app, all the missing apps were GSF apps, which, for now, fits the hypothesis that they never tested Android upgrades for the circumstance that the GSF ID changed.

But why would an Android upgrade even _care_ that a GSF ID had changed? What's it to them?

This is another _new_ learning experience. Why didn't the Windows "dir" command find the zoom installation hierarchy? Where does Zoom put its installed files if not in the system directory?

Yet another new learning experience is the fact that the ease of installing the app is based on "something" (I don't know yet) which is hidden data.

Something about the grayed out icons tells Android exactly which app to find in the FOSS google play store client... however... in one or two cases so far, it did _not_ find the right "something" in that client.

So there's yet more "magic" going on that I don't understand about this yet but it has been a wonderful new learning experience since you can't learn this stuff without some lab work in destructive testing procedures.

I saw it personally.

that's not a citation, nor did you see that.

what you saw was a 20-30 *amp* charger. not volts.

feel free to cite a credible reference to the contrary *and* go back to the garage and take a photo of the charger that you claim was used so that its specs can be verified.

Cite me. I saw it. I am the source.

Nope. Volts. Several electronic devices in my car were destroyed.

that's not how citations work. you can't cite yourself.

what you describe is not how lead acid batteries are charged.

take a photo of the charger and/or find one or more links describing it.

again, take a photo of the charger and/or find some links describing it.

I am a witness.

Nope. It was over a decade ago.

Take my word for it, then you waste your time and find the information. I did that research at the time. What you get is my recollection.

You will not find current information because it is an incorrect and dangerous thing to do; in fact, it destroyed part of the electronics of my car. But I did not know what they were doing at the time or I would have stopped them. I could have sued them.

I don't know where that repair shop would have found such a battery charger unless they were using a 24V charger on a 12V battery.

Trying to charge a nominal 12V battery at 30 volts would have unexpected consequences. The battery is a huge load with very low internal resistance so in order for the vehicle electronics to be damaged the charger must also have been supplying enormous amounts of current.

You can hook up a small, unregulated, 20V solar panel to keep a non-AGM car battery charged because the current is so low (a fraction of an amp) that as soon as you connect the battery the load drops the output to around 12 volts.

apparently the only one, since such a device cannot possibly work.

applying 20-30v to a 12v lead acid battery is a *really* bad idea.

it doesn't matter when it was.

all it takes is to find a device that charges 12v lead acid batteries at 20-30v. it doesn't have to be available for purchase anymore.

let's see its specs, how it works, etc.

note that there are chargers that charge *24v* lead acid batteries at ~29v, except that those batteries are not used in cars, nor would a garage have such a charger because they'll never encounter such a vehicle.

your recollection is not substantive.

find a link or even just an article about the existence of such a charger.

what is working against your claim are countless links about charging lead acid batteries at a constant current until the terminal voltage rises to ~2.4v/cell. i already posted the graph of the various stages.

exactly why such a device does not exist.

if it did exist, there would be *something* written about it somewhere, even if it's nothing more than to avoid it.

a bigger question is how many cars were destroyed by this garage.

you should have sued them for destroying your property as well as the manufacturer of the mythical charger, because such a charger, if it did exist, could cause explosions, which would cause all sorts of damage and injuries, possibly fatal.

exactly

Nope. Just 12 volt battery, huge garage charger with a setting on "boost" or "super boost" mode.

Something like this, but I don't see documentation on the site:

The one they used had wheels.

I think it was rather 20.

Which it did.

CMOS electronics stands 18 volts. Considering that the electronics (the entire display setup) failed maybe two months later, the voltage on the car would have been around 20. The radio survived because it was disconnected. The car was diesel, so no ignition. I think the remote door opener also failed.

The charger was used by someone that was not a full mechanic, but one that was usually on the front desk. A full mechanic would have known that the instructions for that mode say to disconnect the battery from the car because you can fry the electronics. And she did fry the electronics, but unfortunately not instantly, not that minute, so we did not made the connection.

And yes, I did read the documentation, two years later the incident. I found it somewhere, but I do not know the keyword to find it again.

Do you also have a picture of a stack of books to "prove" it?

You are so entirely STUPIDLY wrong it's not even funny.

No you are not. You are an ignorant fool.

those modes are high *current*.

€ Charging current: 18 A

it's also a 12/24v charger. maybe someone set it to 24v, which would quickly destroy a 12v battery and anything connected to it that was expecting only 12v (actually 13.8v when the engine is running).

most high current chargers do.

20 volts, definitely no.

if it was manually set for 24v batteries, it would be ~29v.

here's a graph of charging three types of 12v lead acid batteries. note that the threshold voltage is slightly different for each, and always under 15v. double the values for a 24 battery.

You are a moron who has no idea what you saw, or is simply making s*it up.

And you got the details wrong.

Not a chance in hell. I've seen a lead-acid battery pop its acid when the wrong voltage charger was used, back in the days when VWs had lower volt batteries that the standard 12V.

There we go, you cannot find any source to back up your claim. Congratulations, you have now proved your claim is bullshit.

No you didn't.

Which is worthless.

That is AMPS that are boosted, you numpty moron, not volts.

Translation:

Battery chargers for charging free electrolyte (WET) batteries with 12/24 V voltage, protection against overloads and inversions of polarity. Equipped with an ammeter and normal, fast load selector (BOOST) and ammeter.

And:

Charging current 18 A (12 V) 12 A (24 V)

Ah, your confusion is that "Boost" doesn't increase the voltage being used, it increases the current to a level great enough to start the vehicle even when there is a dead battery loading down the electrical system. See

I have an SUV that I don't drive very often. If I let the battery run down completely I can't even start it with a 50 amp booster, I have to charge the battery for a while (or use a Li-Ion jumper battery which is able to provide a large amount of current for a short time).