Quickie Poll -- C vs. C++

Phil Hobbs expounded in news: snipped-for-privacy@electrooptical.net:

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REXX on a MCU would be perverse indeed.

Warren

Martin Brown expounded in news:lzJdo.7743$ snipped-for-privacy@newsfe22.iad:

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Actually, you can get it for Linux/Cygwin as well (known as Regina).

But it's not my usual tool of choice. On the mainframe however, we don't have much else that compares. I found it useful for testing complex REXX scripts before moving it back to the MF. Otherwise, I much prefer awk.

Warren

I don't know--the statically linked executable is about 393k on Windows, so if you built it for an ARM Cortex M3, say, you could probably slim it down to below 256k, which is less than half the flash available.

Of course scripting usually needs a bunch of I/O, so it usually won't make sense without a disk.

I used to really love HP Basic on the HP9816--it had really great built-in GPIB support, which made instrument control a breeze.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

That's at odds with most descriptions of Phillips screws and screwdrivers. They indicate that Phillips screwdrivers are designed to pop the driver out of the screw before the screw can be over-torqued. When that happens, the screw is usually deformed and cannot be reused.

Mark Borgerson

Or removed. Give me a broken shank any day.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

I lived in NewHampshire for a while and Robertson was available there.

w..

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Oh no! Oh, please no! I have had more trouble with removing Phillips screws than all the rest put together. Inserting a Phillips screw - fine. The screwdriver is pushed into the screw in the same direction the screw is required to travel. To remove the screw the screwdriver must be pushed into the screw against the desired direction of screw travel. An old assembly, perhaps a little corroded or even just stuck and the screw can strart to 'spin'. The *@;*%! things have caused me nightmares.

Mike

On a sunny day (Fri, 27 Aug 2010 08:43:38 -0700 (PDT)) it happened AC Me wrote in :

Yes, take the dremel, and make a nice slot in the head, use a normal screwdriver. Works sometimes.

l.

ts?

"What is your _preferred_ programming language for smallish (1000 lines of code) projects? C? C++? Something else? What? "

You gotta be kidding

Anything smaller than 5000-10000 lines of code has no use of C++ object orientation cause you gonna spend more time and effort designing your classes and stuff (and bloating your code as a result) than actually solving computational problem at hand

C++ is an object-oriented language which was designed specifically to handle complexity of software develoment and maintenance for large projects

"Large" means at least hundreds of thousands of lines

Even some large pieces of software like Apache http server are written in Ansi-C, not C++

For embedded systems bloating the size of your code by using C++ instead of C is highly undesirable

It's like writing whole Java classes to implement a simple parser where the job can be done in 3 lines of dense Perl code (and much more efficiently)

I've removed numerous torx screws, in a pinch, with a regular screwdriver if they aren't too awfully tight; it seems you can usually find an angle and a screwdrive that'll work.

On the other hand, allen (hex) socket screws are hard to deal with without the proper tool.

Phillips screws are actually designed to cam out of the screw head before enough torque can be applied to risk shearing off the screw head. That made sense back when power tools didn't have clutches on them, but it does tend to instead lead to a lot of stripped screws. For use with hand tools, I find Pozidrv screws preferable in that they don't cam out... yet with a hand tool usually there isn't much risk of shearing off the screw head either. (...although an impact driver makes it unlikely to strip Phillips head screws...)

---Joel

Learn to quote, please.

The expert speaks ;-)

For any project. There is no minimum size specified for C++ projects. Ask Stroustrup.

There is no maximum size specified for C projects either. Ask Kernighan or Ritchie.

Using C++ does not bloat the code size, it can even reduce the code size. You just should know what you do.

bye Andreas

Phil Hobbs expounded in news: snipped-for-privacy@electrooptical.net:

Windows,

slim

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Yabbut that hardly fits in the 16KB of an atmega168. ;-)

Warren

With some familiarization, C++ feels simpler now to me. If it's code I'm writing myself. If I'm analyzing/applying someone else's code, all bets are off.

Steve

C++

better type safety, polymorphisnm, not much else

Both, but since I don't use the more bloat-prone features of C++

1. Occasionally 13

C and I would expect access to the source. I would expect clear doc on the heap use (preferably none)

yes

yes

Bob

Admittedly I'm not sure if they are Pozidriv, but I have sheared heads off stainless steel sheetmetal screws. Apparently, aluminum is sticky stuff, the threads sieze and off goes the head. (Note: sheetmetal, so they're forming the thread in situ.) I find it odd that stainless fasteners are that much weaker than their mild steel counterparts (which went in just fine). Though I'm sure it doesn't hurt that galvanizing has a high pressure lubricant effect.

Tim

Of course it's subjective, but I don't see how it could possibly be simpler to have to make decisions on class layout as well as structuring/organizing functions within a class as opposed to structuring a small group of functions. Even if you are only using one class, just carrying around the class baggage is a negative, in my opinion.

Of course.

From a users point-of-view, the best programming language for anything is one that they know. Unfortunately that applies to any language: from Ruby, Python, C++ or Java to APL, Perl, Basic or Forth. Everybody forgets their learning curve and all the hacks they had to acquire over a long period of time to work around their language's oversights and weaknesses.

That's one reason why it's very helpful to be proficient in at least 2 very different programming languages.

IMHO. YMMV.

-- rhn A.T nicholson d.0.t C-o-M

I'm trying to become proficient with lisp (SBCL). I have a good ways to go...

The one that matches the screw. ;-)

Nonsense.

Must have been a *long* time ago. I've used Robertson heads (a.k.a. Square-Head-Recessed) almost exclusively at home (I use some Torx, a.k.a. "star", as well) for about 30 years. The screws and drivers have been sold in every hardware store I've looked for them, for at least 20 years.

They're available everywhere.