Is the Raspberry Pi real at that price?

"Don McKenzie" schreef in bericht news: snipped-for-privacy@mid.individual.net...

The current version is $35,-. The $25,- version has been announced however.

petrus bitbyter

I see it as a cunning plan to wipe out M/soft and all those ancient PCs...

"TTman" schreef in bericht news:jir96q$355$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me...

It certainly attacks some monopolistic behavior of both processor en software giants. As it will not do Windows, it may even become a nail in the MS-coffin. But the design is too light for serious processing power. I merely expect it to become a component more or less like the microprocessor started.

petrus bitbyter

companies, Premier Farnell and RS Components.

how much did it cost wholesale?

may be very wrong with this deal?

Well, you have the "there has to be a dealer margin" bit wrong, RS/Farnell are selling for more than $35, so their margin goes on top.

The product is real, and the idea is good, the only blind-spot is a closed and single sourced chip - but others have/will do similar chips, so that will sort over time, even if it means a new PCB design.

-jg

companies, Premier Farnell and RS Components.

then how much did it cost wholesale?

something may be very wrong with this deal?

single sourced chip - but others have/will do similar chips, so that will sort over time, even if it means a new PCB design.

What CPU chips aren't single sourced these days? As to "closed", I understand that Broadcom is releasing an I/O specification handbook leaving only the GPU as "closed" and that is true for many similar devices.

I'm not sure how much difference the "closed" part will make. I think most people use even open source tools as if they were closed source. I'll never have a need or the ability to recompile Linux for any platform. But that doesn't mean I won't use a Linux enabled smart phone or tablet or even design something to work with one.

Rick

Huh? Is it possible to do _anything_ that isn't completely trivial without using a closed single-sourced chip? I've been doing microcontroller based products for 30 years, and all the major ICs have always been closed and single-sourced. There simply aren't any open, multi-sourced chips with any significant functionality.

I kinda doubt it -- Microsoft Windows 8 will run on ARM. Maybe not the particular one on the Raspberry Pi, but certainly on plenty of other inexpensive, similar chips.

Right -- by the time you turn it into a "real PC" (display, hard drive, keyboard, touchpad, battery, case) and add some profit margins, I think you're largely back to at least the $250-$350 "cheap laptop" that are already quite common.

The cool thing about the Raspberry Pi is that it's quite hackable and that it can be cheap by virtue of the fact that most everyone already has a spare keyboard/mouse sitting around, can use some LCD they already have, etc.

---Joel

Wow, you managed all that, without a single device data sheet ?!

You rather missed the point, which is a complete LACK of information. That is what closed means.

I am sure you had information on ALL those parts you had to use, and heck, probably even an errata sheet to two... ?

Sure, but you are not shipping products pitched for open education.

You have to admit, trying to motivate people to learn, with only a subset of information (and that still vaporware?) is rather self-defeating.

Will a manual sub-set be enough, when other devices have more information ? Time will tell.

companies, Premier Farnell and RS

at $25, then how much did it cost

may be very wrong with this deal?

selling for more than $35, so their

Thanks Jim, so the $35 price it is openly advertised at, is the wholesale price, not the retail price? Who else advertises like that to the public?

So that is $5.77USD profit. A markup margin of 16.49%.

Perhaps someone can do the sums from a US site.

Cheers Don...

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n the

ssor

Now you get it! The LCD as you call it is your TV, and who doesn't have a keyboard and mouse left over from their Pentium days... opps, they still market the Pentium in the low end machines. As to the hard drive, I've got three of them in my pocket and keep a 16GB one in my computer bag. I saw a 32GB one advertised for $27! I don't remember if the rPi will take a full size SD or if you need a micro.

Rick

of information (and that still vaporware?) is rather self-defeating.

Are you being serious? Do you really think the high school kids are going to want to program the GPU?

That is the point. The part they don't want to talk about is the last part you would want to know about and likely couldn't do much with if you had the docs. When you say "other devices", what other devices disclose full info on their GPUs? I've been told this aspect is pretty common. Or maybe they were saying the drivers for the GPUs are not open source. Is this wrong?

Rick

You're right. I completely misunderstood what you meant by the word "closed". I understood it to mean you didn't have access to the "source" for the part (masks, Verilog source, schematics, etc.).

, probably even an errata sheet to two... ?

That is the misinformation. Broadcom IS providing info on the peripheral I/O which is what you want from them. The ARM is the same as everyone else's ARM.... because it's an ARM.

Don't blow the issue out of proportion. I bet the rPi gets a lot of use and a lot of cool stuff will be developed with it just because it is so cheap and everything other than the GPU is open.

Rick

How much do you image the real manufacturing cost of, say, an Android smartphone is ?

geoff

I would imagine it could be in the range of 5% to 20% of the retail price, but it must reach the wholesaler at a price he can make a living out of it, otherwise he wouldn't be in business.

Cheers Don...

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Actually, even Apple isn't able to command that sort of markup with iPhones!

Here's an article that'll give you some more concrete numbers:

The margins in consumer electronics are very thin; it works because there is so much volume. There aren't that many wholesalers left anyway

-- at least in terms of volume, I think it's safe to say the vast majority of electronics goes straight from the manufacturer to a retailer; Wal*Mart and Best Buy aren't getting their phones from a middleman, although some small mom & pop shop likely are.

(Indeed... you sometimes hear small businessmen complain that their costs for products from their wholesalers are more than the retail price from Wal*Mart or Costco...)

---Joel

Thats not entirely true. Shops like WM,BB and similar often have high costs and usually are not cheap. They sell a few items below cost price to appear cheap but with other things they most certainly are not cheap. They are convenient because they have a large stock of many items. Stock costs money. Smaller shops are cheaper in most cases if they have what you need.

But then again, online shops are the future. Nowadays I even order home improvement stuff online.

That's not a 'small business man' that's someone who shouldn't be in business in the first place.

Yes.

Why not ? Some students will want to do exactly that. This is resource that is sitting on their desk, and they have paid for it. Why limit this to High School kids ?

Note the info they have released, not only excludes the GPU, but is very thin on any display interface options.

-jg