DIN standards for reading?

Am 18.11.2015 um 04:59 schrieb DaveC:

Publishing house BEUTH has monopol for DIN standards in Germany. You can watch them at Universities. I didn't find it online.

Maybe a brief description. But you need to purchase the ISO from ANSI or other provider. I've never found a DIN standard freely availble.

Cheers

That depends on your definition of "freely available". At university libraries in Germany (at least at universities with technical faculties), you usually have the possibility to read all DIN standards including VDE standards at one or more computer. Sometimes you also have the possibility to print them on paper for a fee. (DIN, not VDE.)

Best regards,

Sebastian

X-No-archive: Yes

Am Mittwoch, 18. November 2015 04:59:22 UTC+1 schrieb DaveC:

No. No DIN standard (and also, no EN or ISO standard) is completely availab le online.

There are some distributing services who publish the introductory pages but no complete standards.

As mentioned by others, you can look them up at (technical) universities. T here are also books available with collections of certain ranges of standar ds (DIN-Taschenbuecher, DIN-handbooks), they are much cheaper than a single edition (a single edition costs around 50...100EUR, the books cost just as much as a single standard in the orignal edition). The drawback is that th e books (which are revised every few years) do not always contain the lates t version of the standards and are in smaller format so some drawings might be less readable.

However, for certain standards you can find websites citing the essentials but this needs a thorough search on the internet.

Concerning EN standards, they are available in all european languages.

Sebastian Suchanek schrieb:

Some libraries also have paid for the subscription to the online database (Perinorm), so that their users can download these standards as PDF files from a website. There's no need then to print them at library.

Christian

Which DIN?

RL

No one in particular. Am having a friendly disagreement with a friend about what a DIN number means. Does it define things like material, tolerance, finish and hardness or does it include size, thread, etc? In other words, does the DIN number define a particular, specific fastener (including dimension) or only the standards to which that fastener is measured against?

I always related DINs to the US MILSPEC standards which generally are standards, not product definitions.

DIN defines the size of things. Say a bolt with a certain DIN number standard will be so many milimeters long, have a certain number of thread pitch per mm.

I don't know for sure, but suspect that it does not mean the bolt will be so strong or hardened unless aditional informationis added.

Not that familiar with metric standards, but lets use an American bolt as an example. If you want a 1/4-20 bolt then it will be 1/4 inch in diameter and have 20 threads per inch. It may or may not be hardened, made of steel,aluminum or any thing else unless specified.

OK, thanks.

Seems the definition of ?standard? (ie, ?a level of quality or attainment?) is being blurred. It looks like they are being used as product definitions to define specifically all dimensions and aspects of a thing.

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Am Donnerstag, 19. November 2015 18:05:59 UTC+1 schrieb Ralph Mowery:

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It depends... There are DIN (and also european EN and world-wide ISO) stand ards of almost everything.

There are DIN standards for the definition and meaning of terms. There are DIN standards for dimension of nuts, bolts etc. There are DIN standards defining the methods of testing the strength of a b olt etc. There are DIN standards for the marking of bolts according to its strength. There are DIN standards for definition and designators of materials. etc.etc.etc.

It always depends to which standard you refer.

And these are just the mechanical standards. There are lots of standards fo r other fields. Many of them define methods and procedures, such as testing procedures for certain products.

However, there is NO standard defining quality levels. This is always the m atter of the contractors. Even an ISO900x qualification of a supplier does not say anything about the quality of his products, just about the procedur es he uses for testing and documentation.

I know very few US standards but I assume the situation is the same.

Am Donnerstag, 19. November 2015 17:38:23 UTC+1 schrieb DaveC:

As far as I know, MILSPEC standards mainly define test procedures and quali ty levels for goods for military use. In this case, the US army will be the contractor and they can set their own quality level. Of course anyone else can agree with his supplier about the same quality level.

As mentioned in my other posts, there are DIN standards describing test pro cedures but they do not say anything about the necessary quality level.

There are, of course, also "standards" set by the German army or by other o rganizations. For example, the German railway (Deutsche Bahn) have their ow n standards concerning resistance of electronic equipment against shocks an d vibration. Some manufacturers refer to these standards in their catalogue s.

Yes, the DIN is mainly standards so that the parts all fit together. It does not normally define the quality of the item.

Am Donnerstag, 19. November 2015 17:38:23 UTC+1 schrieb DaveC:

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There are DIN (or european EN or worldwide ISO) standards on virtually eve rything.

Of course, everybody thinks first about dimensional standards. Of course, t here are also standards defining test procedures for the strength of bolts etc. and marking according to their strength. There are also standards conc erning the composition and designators of materials, as well as standards c oncerning test procedures for surface hardness etc.etc.

It always depends to which standards the contractors refer. If they refer t o dimensional standards only they agree just about the dimensions. If they include other standards concerning strength etc these standards become part of the contract.

Standards may define test procedures but they never refer to the result of the test. Even a ISO900x qualification of a aupplier does NOT mean that he has an outstanding quality level. It just means that his test procedures ar e performed to certain standards and that he makes documentation according to standard procedures. He can even do this with products of which 90% fail .

Am 19.11.2015 um 18:07 schrieb Ralph Mowery:

Not quite. It is not like one DIN-Number == one bolt (or something else). Each number defines a certain kind of things, therms and everything :-). There is a DIN-Norm for writing a text (i.e. a thesis at the university), there is a DIN-Norm for drawing a cirquit diagram, a house, a 3D drawing or anything else. Most of them have a EN "in back". For example DIN825-1 defines laser safety (yes, I know, this norm is now obsolete but I'm too lazy to find new numbers), the adequate European Norm is EN60825-1. Another example: DIN912 defines cylindrical bolts with allen key fitting. All of them. Including UNC & UNF i.e. non-metric bolts.

HTH

Waldemar

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Am Dienstag, 24. November 2015 17:01:12 UTC+1 schrieb Waldemar:

Are you sure that there are DIN standard dimensions for UNC and UNF threads ? I do not think so.

There are some threads of non-metric origin which are used and standardized in Germany, too, like the threads used for plumbing tubes. The dimensions, of course, are indicated in mm but the values are rather odd.

The german industry does not support the usage of non-metric threads for st andard fasteners. In all catalogues of dealers of nuts and bolts I could fi nd things like "non-metric bolts with UNC threads similar to DIN912" which means that their appearance is similar to the standard of metric bolts.

Am 25.11.2015 um 13:48 schrieb snipped-for-privacy@web.de:

I'm not sure but some distributors claim to sell DIN912 UNC and UNF bolts. For example this one:

I do not have access to DIN standards.

Waldemar

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Am Donnerstag, 26. November 2015 11:55:17 UTC+1 schrieb Waldemar:

As mentioned, I have seen ads showing "bolts with UNC threads similar to DI N912". Some of these sellers mention that the UNC/UNF threads comply with A NSI standards. Also, if you click on the DIN912 link in the ad mentioned, a n excerpt of DIN912 shows up ... mentioning metric threads only.

same here but I have severe doubts that there are DIN threads with non-metr ic dimensions for standard fasteners.

w-buechsenschuetz wrote on Thu, 15-11-26 19:18:

That's what books of tables are for. I find DIN 13 for metric threads (just the treads, there are other standards for the whole bolt referring here for the thread), DIN 2999 describing the Whitworth thread for tubes (cylindrical inside, cone-shaped outside), DIN 103 for trapezoid metric threads (for movement not fastening as in a vice) BUT the Whitworth tread for bolts i.e. 3/8" is listed as /not standardized/ so there is indeed no DIN for it. As that was mentioned here before, DIN 898 decribes strength classes for bolts and nuts and i.e. DIN 609 and many others the shapes and lengths of bolts and their heads.

So yes, there is a DIN for a non-metric thread but only for a special case, not for simple nuts and bolts.

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Am Freitag, 27. November 2015 19:14:55 UTC+1 schrieb Axel Berger:

I think this is exactly what I mentioned before. Besides the Whitworth thre ads for tubes, there are lots of standards for inch-dimension based threads , like the Fg thread (Fg = Fahrradgewinde, threads used on bicycles) and the Vg threads (Vg = Ventilgewinde, threads used on tire valves).

Unfortunately, some manufacturers decided to use a mix of inch and metric d imensions. There are some bicycle parts which usually come with a thread wi t 26TPI (threads per inch) pitch but some manufacturers use threads with sa me diameter but 1,0mm pitch which is close enough to match parts together f irst and ruin them after a few turns..

German DIN standards turn more and more away from non-metric or oddly dimen sioned threads to metric ones. For example, many years ago there was a stan dard for Pg (Panzerrohr-Gewinde, threads on protection tubes for cables) wh ich was based on the inner diameter of the tubes, so the outer thread diame ters had odd metric values. This standard was cancelled years ago and repla ced by a standard defining the threads of such tubes with pure metric dimen sions (outer diameter and pitch) with common dimensions.