Transistor backwards... But it works ?_?

Oh really? news to me. I've used Bode charts for what ever scale graphing I was doing as to the vertical and horizontal parameters in a time sweep manner. Using a AB generator you do need to supply a time frame that varies the output in such cases, I don't understand what you're talking about otherwise.

First off, I did something like that this morning and saw that at 1.0 S time I was able to see the hft drop off as saturation approached, which leads me to my suspicions of what I thought earlier, then I selected a 100 us sweep and notice there is a difference between using it in forward verses reverse operation. I didn't bother to do the charge calculations since this was just a pet experiment. All don't with a AB gen, scope and PC.

I also did a common base configuration and found the same response to be just about equal to the reverse operation, even though beta was less than 1 in that state of course.

One item of note I did see how ever, the test voltage must stay below the break down of EB, otherwise, the DUT becomes useless afterwards if the zener currents are sustained. I left one on for a while and then did a beta test. It dropped considerably. This was to verify what JL commented on, something I should of remembered de years ago.

So conclusion is, yes it does work and yes I found the beta to roll off as saturation approached but, I also found that you must be careful with zenering the emitter, especially when it reaches the negative voltage region, you get a nice pulse oscillator then..

I suppose if the unloaded state had no more than lets say 5 Volts on it you'd most likely be safe, since most transistors I've seen do not zener in that region, but near by.

Jamie

Correct. I guess "Bode chart" is his name for a piece of log/log graph paper.

D'you have any idea what an "AB generator" is?

Allen Bradley? Certainly not "Jamie" in college.

The classic cross-coupled astable multivibrator drives each base negative wrt each emitter while each coupling capacitor discharges. Not a problem unless the junctions zener, just something to watch out for.

The Rockwell Retro-Encabulator, maybe ;-)

Criminal loss of headroom, but.

RL

Clue less... really, you are..

Your comrade sheep buddies are calling you, you better run and get right to their party.. They said something of you being the main attraction.

Jamie

Oh really, when I perform a sweep at difference frequencies looking for response curves to ratios of other information, I think I have covered it.

Go rally with the other herders that you hold so dearly as the authorities. It seems that I manage to actually get things done with out much effort? There is a reason for that, one you most likely wouldn't understand.

They're two kinds of people, those that need no explanation and know which end up and then there are those like yourself, Lost and willing to follow a blind path.

All I hear is sheep.

Jamie

According to Google, they are standby power generators. Maybe Maynard means 'Arbitrary Waveform' generator?

That is the bleating of the other 'Lid' hams.

You're the one who apparently thinks graph paper is called "Bode paper".

Maynard, you really are as stupid as Michael says.

I think, no, I know, you're clueless. You said, "I've used Bode charts for what ever scale graphing I was doing as to the vertical and horizontal ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ parameters in a time sweep manner." ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

With that definition of "Bode chart", *any* graph qualifies. Clearly clueless, Maynard.

It would have been much easier if you'd just said, "oops, sorry, what I said was wrong". ...or even STFU because you *clearly* are wrong.

Maynard, you're really stepping into the deep end.

Sometimes all we hear are our women. Even the sheep wouldn't stay around you if they had a choice.

Should be something like 20mV, at least that's what it was in that National IC from the 70s where it's used- the LM-whatmacallit...20?

from the 70s where it's used- the LM-whatmacallit...20?

LM385

There's also a 1.2V version:

IC from the 70s where it's used- the LM-whatmacallit...20?

That's a bandgap. This is more like the LM10 reference, which is iirc about 200 mV, but this one will be lower than that. It's sort of a peaking current source driving a diode drop, and subtracting that from a V_BE.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

National IC from the 70s where it's used- the LM-whatmacallit...20?

Ummm- check out Fig. 20 of the old LM211 datasheet- Low Voltage Adjustable Reference Supply, with the 2N3708 and 2N2222