Quercus Douglasii

ic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and foothills of the Sierra Nevada.

s the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

h most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found several unlog ged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may harbor over 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forests.

experiencing 500 year drought...

bristle-cone

just cored

est

study.

dy.

evada.

earcher killed a pine? When it turns out this happened a half century ago a nd had nothing at all do with the modern study of global warming...

It's not a false claim. He slew the tree for his climate study.

"He was one of many people seeking to develop chronologies of climatic change during the "Little Ice Age," which at the time was defined in very general terms as a 400-year period when global temperatures dropped slightly, reaching a minimum in the early 1600s. He was looking for old bristlecones close to or on a glacial moraine which might register climatic conditions, and he found them."

You've made an artificial distinction. I don't accept it.

That suggests a few good bumper stickers though: "Climastrology, killing national treasures since 1964." "Climate science: travel new places, kill old things."

Cheers, James Arthur

mic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and foothills of the Sierra Nevada.

is the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

gh most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found several unlo gged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may harbor ove r 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forests.

s experiencing 500 year drought...

e 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something.

a bristle-cone

just cored

dest

g study.

udy.

Nevada.

And they bristle.

Cheers, James

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 8:43:57 PM UTC-4, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wr ote:

emic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and foothill s of the Sierra Nevada.

is the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

ugh most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found several unl ogged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may harbor ov er 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forests.

is experiencing 500 year drought...

he 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something.

a bristle-cone

d just cored

ldest

ng study.

tudy.

Nevada.

esearcher killed a pine? When it turns out this happened a half century ago and had nothing at all do with the modern study of global warming...

You didn't say "climate study," your original statement was:

"Oh, pardon my recollection, he took a chainsaw and CUT DOWN the oldest living thing on earth, a 5,100 year-old tree. For a global warming study."

You see, you said ***global warming study***

Nah- you're trying to impugn global warming science by ridiculing a researc her (post grad) who wasn't even studying global warming and from a time whe n it wasn't even an idea.

I've probably got a soul - or as much of a soul as anybody has.

But I do take it hard when James Arthur, whose ignorant skepticism about anthropogenic global warming means that he's aligned himself with a political movement - denialism - which is working hard to drive a lot of species into extinction, gets sentimental about a particular long-lived organism.

It's probably not even an individual, but rather a genetic mosaic - trees do self-graft, particularly when they are hanging on in tiny marginal microclimates, as the bristle-cone pine does, thus not as uniquely old as he is trying to claim.

Yeah, ours are likely Jefferys.

Full of explosive n-heptane!

They're one and the same. I'm only as sloppy as the people who keep changing the PC phrases.

Though inarticulately expressed, I think I see your point: that this slaying wasn't AGW-theory-motivated. Conceded.

(The tree and family will be greatly relieved.)

Cheers, James Arthur

Your insults might be hurtful and your opinions might be valued if anyone respected you.

e:

k endemic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and foo thills of the Sierra Nevada.

t. It is the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

although most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found severa l unlogged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may harb or over 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forests.

rnia is experiencing 500 year drought...

ted the 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something.

cored a bristle-cone

d he'd just cored

lah/

the oldest

warming study.

der study.

ierra Nevada.

old

dering

Strictly speaking, n-heptane isn't explosive. It presumably can form explos ively combustible mixtures with air, which - once ignited - can generated a combustion-fuelled supersonic shock wave, but no tree, no matter how heavi ly loaded with n-heptane, is going to explode.

A bunch of them might evaporate off enough n-heptane to produce a very comb ustible atmosphere and a natural air-fuel bomb, but that wouldn't make n-he ptane explosive.

You should have paid more attention in those chemistry lectures.

On Wednesday, 16 September 2015 13:05:54 UTC+10, snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com wrot e:

erra Nevada.

ng researcher killed a pine? When it turns out this happened a half century ago and had nothing at all do with the modern study of global warming...

dy."

Rubbish. Climate studies may include global warming studies, but climate st udies have been going on for much longer, from long before time when the id ea that the globe might be warming up or cooling down as a whole was ration ally conceivable. They clearly aren't "one and the same".

Again rubbish. You used an emotionally loaded and incorrect phrase for rhet orical effect. That makes you lying political propagandist - politically in correct, however you spin the activity.

The distinction is real. Your failure to accept it's reality is simply dish onest - quite as dishonest as your original formulation.

earcher (post grad) who wasn't even studying global warming and from a time when it wasn't even an idea.

ing

The tree and it's family has about a much effective reasoning power as Jame s Arthur. The trees don't have neurones, while James Arthur does, but his n eurones are so thoroughly programmed to conform to his political ideology t hat they can't do anything original or creative.

They won't care about their chopped down relative, any more than James Arth ur does (albeit they can't, and James Arthur might, if he wasn't a preprogr ammed spam generator).

People do respect Fred Bloggs - he often knows what he's talking about, and supports his opinions with links to real information.

You don't seem to.

No you are deliberately attempting to slur climate change research with the accusation that they ordered this tree be killed when in fact it was cut down fully twenty years before AGW was even on the agenda. The researcher seemed to take a fair amount of flak for his actions too.

Actually did cutting it down actually kill it?

Some old established trees have sufficient reserves in their root system to come back from total destruction of the top growth (part of what allows them to live for so long). They have to have withstood many extreme winters, winds and the odd forest fire over that long lifetime.

It seemed to be mainly motivated by the fact that the guy needed to finish his research and the tree boring kit he had with him failed.

Whilst it may be a shame that one particularly old tree got sacrificed for science it does provide a very good dendrochronology resource. I presume slices of it are now in various museums and research centres.

The same happens to to odd slow growing coral sample and stalactite even today. Certain long lived species and geological features make very good climate records allowing much to be inferred about local temperatures and globally the amount of water locked up in snow and ice and a few of them do get sacrificed to provide that information.

These days they try to avoid collecting rare or endangered species for this purpose.

Nor do you in spite of your egotistical historical references to a rather obscure publication.

Please provide proof that anyone respects Bloggs other than you. Do you follow him around?

What your kind values or respects is of no concern to me whatsoever.

Do quote the particular reference you have in mind. It could be one of several.

For you? That would imply a level of respect for you that I can't manage.

No.

ote:

oak endemic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and f oothills of the Sierra Nevada.

ght. It is the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

, although most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found seve ral unlogged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may ha rbor over 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forests.

fornia is experiencing 500 year drought...

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ested the 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something.

y cored a bristle-cone

red he'd just cored

selah/

N the oldest

l warming study.

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andering

osively combustible mixtures with air, which - once ignited - can generated a combustion-fuelled supersonic shock wave, but no tree, no matter how hea vily loaded with n-heptane, is going to explode.

Bill, I believe JL was referring to this section in the wiki article.

George H.

mbustible atmosphere and a natural air-fuel bomb, but that wouldn't make n- heptane explosive.

I was originally chiming in to support Fred's first-post concern--

"That is one tough tree. Thankfully some ass never harvested the 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something."

Fred fretted that a 500-year-old Douglas Fir risked sacrifice to make someone's hot-tub, reminding me of an actual example of a much older, rarer tree being felled in real-life for a different fool's errand.

Artistic by nature, I was feeling the tragic loss of an ancient living thing, not focusing on Bilious' ever-changing living and breathing nomenclature for his favorite religious devotion.

It's a left-right brain thing.

Other articles refer to people visiting the 'slab', which suggest to me the poor creature is quite dead.

The hubris amazes me. In life, without even knowing the Methuselah Tree's tale, I didn't presume to even touch one. It would never occur to me to cut one down, any more than to fetch a hacksaw and saw clean through one of the Eiffel Tower's legs to get a look at its metal.

Deadwood could've provided the same information without killing a living thing.

One can only hope...

Cheers, James Arthur

te:

f oak endemic to (found only in) California, common in the Coast Ranges and foothills of the Sierra Nevada.

light. It is the most drought tolerant of California's deciduous oaks.

ed, although most are less than 300 years old. Recent research has found se veral unlogged stands of blue oak woodlands, suggesting that the state may harbor over 500,000 acres (200,000 ha; 2,000 km2) of such old-growth forest s.

lifornia is experiencing 500 year drought...

-dry/

rvested the 500 year old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something.

guy cored a bristle-cone

vered he'd just cored

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OWN the oldest

bal warming study.

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plosively combustible mixtures with air, which - once ignited - can generat ed a combustion-fuelled supersonic shock wave, but no tree, no matter how h eavily loaded with n-heptane, is going to explode.

Even John Larkin should know enough to realise that n-heptane isn't going t o explode. Since resin distillation doesn't occur under vacuum, the distill eries got blown up by self-made fuel-air bombs.

They might not have appreciated this, but anybody who has sat through first year undergraduate chemistry lectures (as John Larkin claims to have done) should know enough to realise that n-heptane isn't an explosive.

combustible atmosphere and a natural air-fuel bomb, but that wouldn't make n-heptane explosive.

-- Bill Sloman, Sydney

erra Nevada.

ing > > >>>> researcher killed a pine?

est

study."

old specimens to build a ...hot tub...or something."

er

Scarcely a fool's errand. The little ice age is an interesting phenomenon, and we still don't know exactly what was going on back then.

ing,

for

Your artistic nature is most evident in your creative handling of facts, wh ich do turn out to be subordinate to the message you want to communicate.

But both halves of James Arthur's brain are devoted to propagating the righ t-wing message.

he

You miss the point. The 'slab' was the trunk. The root system wasn't dug up and might well have pushed up new shoots and new foliage. When we cut down rotten trees in our garden on Nijmegen (so they didn't damage the neighbou rs' houses when they - the tree - got blown over) the stumps were very pron e to pushing out new shoots next spring.

cut > one down, any more than to fetch a hacksaw and saw clean through one of the

Of course, you would have to recognsie the tree as a Methuselah before you respected it. One scrubby little tree looks very like another until some he lpful botanist screws a brass plate ontpo the trunk.

It would do, if you knew exactly where it came from. A root system does ens ure locality.

Greenland and Antarctic ice cores routinely diminish the relevant ice sheet s in the same way. One could hope that James Arthur were moved to protect t he ice sheets from vandals - it would at least take him away from his inter net connection.

Tree huggers with money gets lots of attention.