I'm amazed anyone in the first coach managed to survive at all, unless some of that damage is from extraction equipment. That car looks completely mangled and shredded.
I remember reading about the Chase Maryland crash that happened in 1987; apparently the jaws of life equipment rescue was using then had a very difficult time with the stainless steel alloy those cars were made from.
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I believe they're actually made from a Nickel alloy... Inconel?...
was called International Nickel (INCO) in my home town. GM of that company was my first stage interview for admission to MIT.
As for the crash... the distracted engineer upped the damage by waking up and hitting the emergency brake in the middle of the curve. ...Jim Thompson
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I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
Den torsdag den 14. maj 2015 kl. 22.54.52 UTC+2 skrev Jim Thompson:
Inconel would be surprising, it is very hard to work with and made for high temp stuff like inside jet engines and such
-Lasse
I don't think so. When I was a kid there was great hoopla when it was used on a whole new set of passenger cars for the C&O Railroad... (now known as CSX)...
"Led by industrialist C. P. Huntington, it reached from Virginia's capital city of Richmond to the Ohio River by 1873, where the railroad town (and later city) of Huntington, West Virginia was named for him."
Huntington, WV, my hometown.
...Jim Thompson
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| James E.Thompson | mens |
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| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
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I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
I read that there were many broken ribs and few head injuries. That's good, but broken ribs really hurt. Trust me on that one.
There is a GPS-based system that's supposed to know the routes and manage the trains. That doesn't seem very difficult. It might have woken up the engineer, or applied the brakes.
Apparently that section of track isn't equipped for that yet.
It's a shame that "standard gauge" tracks are only 4'8.5" apart. That makes things tip over easier. Of course that train was doomed anyhow, at 107 MPH.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
They're based on the old Metroliner trainsets built for (I believe) the PRR. Which were then inherited by the short lived Penn Central, which were then inherited by Amtrak and used well into the 1980s. The Amfleet coaches, however, were new construction specifically for Amtrak when it was formed, along with the EMD SDP40 diesel and GE E60 electric. The above locomotives had problems and I guess they were eventually replced by the F40PH and AEM-7 respectively.
I think the car bodies are just high chromium stainless steel.
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On Thu, 14 May 2015 14:03:51 -0700 (PDT), Lasse Langwadt Christensen Gave us:
It is an extremely expensive alloy, and would not have been used to panel rail cars with.
On Thu, 14 May 2015 14:58:42 -0700, Jim Thompson Gave us:
It was used in very specific places in the frames and trucks, not the compartment paneling.
On Thu, 14 May 2015 15:37:05 -0700, John Larkin Gave us:
Freight trains have loads which result in lower COGs. A passenger car should have an AL frame and trucks, and would have been easier to stop and less likely to roll. They should be using it but do not, except for the skins. I think it is pretty lamer to use a frame meant for 200 ton loads for a 30 ton load.
All passenger cars should be mostly Al based. I think it is one of the biggest mistake ALL rail industry companies make.
There is no reason to use a platform meant to haul heavy freight for a passenger haul scenario. It is like 6X overkill.
A jet has an AL body and wing superstructure. The goddamned rail car makers should have to do so as well.
Stopping distances would be cut in half at a minimum.
Only if people use the brakes in time.
-- John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com
Isn't the old joke that some rocket components are the size they are to fit through standard gauge railroad tunnels, which are the size they are to accommodate the tracks, which are the size they are because of Roman chariots? "Two horses asses..."
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On Thu, 14 May 2015 17:11:58 -0700, John Larkin Gave us:
Speeds around turns could also be less of a factor if the engine was also made in a lighter, lower COG version.
On Thu, 14 May 2015 20:25:04 -0400 (EDT), bitrex Gave us:
Rails are at the gauge they are because wider gauges would mean HUGE heavy trucks (the quad wheel guys under the cars). Being cast iron, they would be many tons heavier.
All this was decided BEFORE Aluminum became a wide use metal.
There is no reason a new high speed cross country rail system shouldn't be a wider gauge and use Aluminum casting trucks and frames.
This would make a far better center of gravity scenario.
Of course, my HS rail system would be mag lev and the rails and wheel would be above the train and only needed when the mag lev is lost.
Even without mag lev, I think suspended car, overhead rail would be a far better far safer design/form factor.
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno Wrote in message:
Won't there be galvanic corrosion issues at the aluminum-steel interface?
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It would be nice if utility power was 240 V 400 Hz all over the world, or if every country had automobile traffic on the same side of the road, but there's very little ability to change either of those things at this point.
In the US, if the passenger train is sharing tracks with freight, the main reason this happens is the Federal Railroad Administration buff strength rules. I think what they were originally trying to prevent is that when one passenger car stops moving and the one behind it keeps moving, either the first car gets crushed (like, the frame breaks), or the second car rides up over the frame of the first car and "telescopes" inside the first car. This happened a lot when cars had wood bodies on iron or not-very-strong-steel frames, and requiring stronger frames and bodies was probably a good idea, back then.
Now, the rules seem to be about where the automakers were in 1970, for passenger safety: they are made so the *vehicle* doesn't get bent. It took a while, but eventually the automakers decided it was better for the *vehicle* to get bent - in a somewhat controlled way - to help save the passengers.
The FRA rules also mean that it's hard for European or Japanese passenger railcars to be used "as is" in the US. I don't know if any builders outside the US even offer passenger cars to US spec.
There is also a philosophical difference between "you're going to hit things, energy is cheap, build the trains heavy" and "try like hell not to hit things, energy is expensive, build the trains lighter". The US is more towards the former category; a lot of the rest of the world is more towards the latter.
The latest TGV (France), ICE (Germany), and Shinkansen (Japan) high- speed passenger trains have aluminum carbodies, but I *think* they still have steel frames. Older models have steel bodies.
US lines that have dedicated track, like a lot of subway systems, can and do run lighter-weight equipment. They can get bids from several railcar companies, as their requirements are much closer to what those companies already make for other customers.
Matt Roberds
On Thu, 14 May 2015 21:16:56 -0400 (EDT), bitrex Gave us:
Where did I say that it would have or need Al wheels?
Using Al on the major castings making up the trucks would save tons of weight. Using it in frame rails yet more.
The transport rails and the wheels would still be steel. That is on current rail systems.
The suspended rail system would be mag lev, and lost levitation would drop the cars onto a gantry not unlike those used in roller coasters, and would likely be on poly faced wheels.
Despite everyone's desire to sight see on today's trains, this high speed rail system would be an enclosed U/G concrete structure, the side walls of which would be where the gantry apparatus would ride in the event of levitation system failure.
On Fri, 15 May 2015 03:54:15 +0000 (UTC), snipped-for-privacy@att.net Gave us:
Siemens provides most of the US "trolley"system cars.
North County San Diego's system uses standard rail and is Siemens hardware. Still largely steel and cast iron trucks and frameworks.
Other parts of Cali may get built more locally, like the BART system up north.
Even though they never break 50 mph.
The last I heard on TV news was that the train was equipped with an automatic braking system, AND that section of track had the equipment installed but it was NOT TURNED ON!
Lawyers will be having a field day with this one.
Here's more info:
Sad...
Paul
I is my understanding that the problems and losses caused by transmission line reactive impedances of the present 50/60Hz systems is an awesome amount, and utilities would like to use DC
On Fri, 15 May 2015 01:12:18 -0400, "P E Schoen" Gave us:
After hearing about the "engineer"'s blogging, it wouldn't surprise me if he was not trying to "provide an example".
AFAIK, there is no way for an engine to malfunction and rev up..
It went into that top speed in the last minute, and did so just as it approached the turn. So even as he hit the brakes, he did not decell the "motor" of the engine.
All this crap I am hearing about engineers not wanting control cabin cameras is lame too. It should not be up to them, and Amtrak etc. allowing them to influence safety measure decisions is just lame too.
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