fast embedded processor/controller

You _can't_ have looked hard enough. The TMS320F2812 comes to mind. You might try the ARM chips from Atmel. Web search for "embedded processor survey" or something like that -- a couple of the magazines publish a design guide at least once a year.

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Tim Wescott
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I am looking for

- a microcontroller (single chip, no separate memories)

- fast (50..100 MIPS would be nice, more is better)

- reasonable amount of memory (at least 16k FLASH code, 16k RAM)

What are the alternatives in this field? I know the dsPICs, the Philips ARM chips, maybe a Rabbit, what else?

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

I'll check those.

I checked those, but they are thumb-only chips, so a bit slower than the Philips ARM chips. And the ones for which I tried to get the datasheets had 'preliminary info' only.

That turns up lost of 8051-comparisons, but that's not what I am after.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

That's kinda normal for many datasheets actually. At least it means it's unlikely to be dropped from the range shortly.

Graham

Reply to
Pooh Bear

Did you already look at a DSP from Texas Instr. or Analog devices? Most modern DSPs are very similar to a microcontroller.

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Nico Coesel

Yeah, thats a fault Atmel is often blamed for. But in comparision: I checked a few of the AVR pages and none states 'preliminary'.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

So far the ARMs seem to be the chips at the ~ 60 MHz level, the DSPs are the step beyond that. But a TMS320F2812 is stated at TI's webpage at 150 MHz, yet the ones at DigiKey are 20 or 40 MHz. When I can't find a chip at

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I tend to gen nervous about using it. This is a small-volume project (

Reply to
Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

Depends how often they get round to revising them and / or if they actually need to.

I've seen plenty of devices in full production for some time where the data sheet still says preliminary. Don't let it put you off.

Graham

Reply to
Pooh Bear

But you're in the Netherlands. Why concern yourself about DigiKey ?

Surely you have local agents ? TI have a big office in Bedford UK that would be able to help you I'm sure. I've always found them to be very helpful and the field reps will visit even small customers.

Graham

Reply to
Pooh Bear

It was not a datahseet with 'perliminray' stamped over it. The product page has only and 'preliminary product info' link, no real datasheet. But I have found some Atmel ARMs that are in stock at DigiKey, so I must assume they are for real. But the difference with the Philips chips I already know is small.

Atmel also has the AT91RM9200 at 200 MHz, but that one does not have internal flash.

IMHO the Atmel documentation people deserve a whipping for hiding details. The whole group is called 'ARM Thumb processorrs'. Some (like the AT91RM' specifically state that they support both the 32 and 16 bit instruction sets, some don't. This at least gives me the uncomformatble feeling that those might be thumb-only processors.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

The world is my backyard, I don't care much where a supplier is located (some of my favourite suppliers are in China).

As a rule of thumb I try to use only things that are available at DigiKey. Not because I always want to buy there, but as a check for general availability.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

They do like to visit even the smaller companies, but when you want to place an order you are usually faced with minimum order quantities and long lead times. In my experience local agents are a PITA. I prefer to buy from companies like Digikey, Farnell or directly from the manufacturor.

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Reply to
Nico Coesel

Strange. I've normally found Atmel data to be very good.

A case of talking to the applications ppl I reckon.

Graham

Reply to
Pooh Bear

Long lead times apply to all users to be honest. Best to try and avoid scarce parts like that.

An MOQ of around 100 parts isn't unreasonable and not untypical. If it's a years production - then OK you have to carry some stock.

You pay a *fortune* when buying through Farnell though. That convenience and availability comes at a price.

Graham

Reply to
Pooh Bear

Cygnal makes a 100MHz nearly 100MIPS version of the 8051. I'm not usre about how much RAM it has but its got 128K of FLASH.

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Ken Smith

True, but when you are buying larger quantities Farnell's prices approach or even beat the prices you'll get from a distributor. For smaller quantities, most distributors will charge you an extra fee as well. Since most distributors over here carry only a limited number of brands, you'll end up paying the 'small orders fee' several times if you buy small amounts. Also, add the hassle of sorting out who's selling what, placing and tracking several orders, etc, etc. Over all I don't think Farnell is much more expensive than a distributor.

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Nico Coesel

In this case it is not so much the datasheet itself, but the pages on which it is presented. Reading the actual datasheet I soon found 'supports 32-bit and 16-bit instruction set', but when taking a first glance at a number of chips I don't real all the datasheets. The trouble is that they call the chips 'ARM Thumb'. I dunno whether this is common knowledge, but ARM is the general term, Thumb is the 16-bit instruction set. So the term 'ARM Thumb' made me suspicious: maybe they just support theb16-bit instructions? It is a bit uncomfortable that I must read the datasheet to be reassured.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

Dikey prices for the amounts I am looking for (20..50) are much more reasonable.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

Even if that's a 1-clock-per-instruction version of the 8051 (does that exist at all?) it still would not match a 60 MHz ARM for most tasks.

Wouter van Ooijen

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Wouter van Ooijen (www.voti.nl

True but, the Cygnal part has a lot of other stuff on the chip too. For many of the things the Cygnal part is good for, the ARM solution would require additional chips. It is worth checking out.

Analog devices Shark running at 60MHz would beak the ARM for many situations. Unfortunately it is less self contained.

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