Drift mechanisms

Nov 08, 2014 29 Replies

Is there some DC feedback around this circuit that isn't shown?

How about taking the cap out of the picture? Leave the op amp in the "off" mode. Disconnect the cap from the high impedance node and replace it with a high value resistor back to the 6V supply, then set up a scope to trigger on the jump. See if something in the room sets it off. That fet has a 10nA leakage, which would be a mV with 100k resistor, so a volt drop would be

1e8. You probably have 100Mohm handy. You will have to AC couple the scope to get around the drift due to gate leakage.

With high impedance driving CMOS opamp, you can detect a piezo igniter going off from across the room. I ran into this with an amplifier being fed with pyroelectric film.

They test gambling machines in the proximity of piezo lighters, just to insure they don't glitch.

How about this?

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When the pushbutton is open, there's no popcorn noise!

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com

The PLL itself.

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc picosecond timing precision measurement jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Just checked, the varactor is much too leaky for that. It has a time constant under a second, and that's with some RC lowpasses already attached.

Actually, I think I didn't even use a varactor proper -- it doesn't need much pull or linearity in this application, and that saves having to go out and buy some oddball component.

Tim

Seven Transistor Labs Electrical Engineering Consultation Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com

I'm aware of dielectric absorption, but it's not a big deal in this application: the sampling is the same every time, so after a few shots, it should "learn" to go away, more or less. It's a good catch in other applications, though!

Tim

-- Seven Transistor Labs Electrical Engineering Consultation Website:

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Yes, two oscillators (one under control), one mixer. The mixer is DC coupled, so I can do handy things like PLL from it. Which has the curious property that, as a control loop, it doesn't care which polarity the error amplifier (this circuit in question) is wired in.

More background here:

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Sorry for not making that clear initially,

Tim

Seven Transistor Labs Electrical Engineering Consultation Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com

  • Talk to Einstein about that..

  • Yes, cosmic rays might be the source. Take the instrument to another place, 30 or more miles away and look for similar long-term "average" and similar "pops".
  • Do not know about the theory,but ages ago Intel had this PMOS RAM that used unusual voltages like -5,+12,+7 or some messy combination of supplies. In any event, one could write a pattern in some of them, unplug the RAM, and come back in a day or two and plug it back in and reliably read that pattern. Stored charge in the oxide (glass). I expect that air, a better insulator, may be worse because it can more easily be ionized by cosmics. A FET with a non-protected gate can store a charge for days. Fairchild data sheet makes no specific mention either way about the gate. Expect ACTUAL max leakage to be picoamps, not microamps. Do a test. Make a linear amp, meter on drain, charge on gate for some nominal current, and watch the meter - paint drying is more exciting.

Yes, an excellent article on S&H, leakages, how-to-do.

Not any off-the shelf switch; a DIY in-the-air switch. Dig up that Pease article..

A 2N7000 with a floating gate can hang partially on for days. Gate leakage must be not very many electrons per second. Here's a 2N7000 driving an LED partly on, floating gate:

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You can take a small insulated screwdriver and tap gate/V+/gnd and transfer charge up/down onto the gate in tiny steps. Short drain to gate briefly to establish the partly-on state

Win Hill did this, for drain leakage:

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I wonder what negative gate voltage might do.

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com http://www.highlandtechnology.com

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