Copperless military PCBs

The "only" true advantage of a PCB-based design is its HUGE potential for automated production and testing, with all the obvious implications of this fact, such as a cheap final product and repeatabe parameters. Other factors (cooling, impedance of power planes, signal integrity, reliability) are inferior to what can be achieved using older or more exotic techniques. For most of the time it is not worth the effort, as the PCB is good enough, sometimes going full custom pays off. Printed Wiring Boards, for one example, they still seem to be available from Hitachi. A piece of good coax connecting various points on the same PCB is another example of a superior hybrid solution. With a planar trace you just can't get even close to the performance level offered by a dedicated solution. This is all clear.

But, at the other extreme, I occasionally see military-grade electronics mounted on an FR4 substrate, but without the use of *any* copper layers. Absolutely everything is manually wired. This is probably the best example of this wiring obsession:

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but these are good too:

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What were those guys trying to achieve, if even a single copper layer would have allowed them to route all the obvious stuff and apply wiring only where truly needed? These are avionics/military designs, so I presume they were made by real experts, not a bunch of loonies.

Best regards, Piotr

Reply to
Piotr Wyderski
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Single layer/side (SS) PCBs have a problem with cracking/cold solder connections on heavier components (1W & up resistors for example), it takes very little motion for SS PCB parts to fail at the solder connections or rip the trace off the board and then break the copper.

I find that the 70s vintage commercial grade US tech that used single sided PCBs had a number of failures due to poorly supported parts...

Those 1970s Russian units look like they could handle a fair bit of abuse. I have no experience with US military grade 1970s tech, but assume they would be also very robust and am guessing that it was unlikely that the US military would use SS PCBs either.

John :-#)#

Reply to
John Robertson

Decadent capitalist PCB-machine expensive and slave labor was cheap

Reply to
bitrex

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The way that board is done the solder joints aren't likely to be broken by mechanical shock. With regular PCBs they are. The wires don't look well res trained though.

NT

Reply to
tabbypurr

On a sunny day (Tue, 24 Sep 2019 23:52:07 +0200) it happened Piotr Wyderski wrote in :

Yes military stuff, I can buy this here for 20 Euro (about 20 USD):

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It is old, an antenna tuner, but shows how to do mechanics, it will probably survive a little banging.

PCBs are vulnarable, not flexible on impact etc. I have build complex wired stuff that still works 100% after 30 years...

What is even worse is connectors soldered on PCBs, just plug in often enough and the soldering fails.

It is a different world, from the buy a new '?phone' every 2 years...

Reply to
Jan Panteltje

The proletariat needs work!

Tim

--
Seven Transistor Labs, LLC 
Electrical Engineering Consultation and Design 
Website: https://www.seventransistorlabs.com/
Reply to
Tim Williams

His accent is so thick I turned on the subtitles.

A sample from 1:18-

"You have to be a nun with choker bells..."

I turned them back off.

I expect it would survive a twenty-foot drop onto concrete.

Or two.

We called those "post boards" when I was in the USAF in the early 1970s.

Don't get me started.

The article in the video is like a lot of military gear- designed to survive worst-case "users" who had no personal investment in the equipment surviving.

Mark L. Fergerson

Reply to
alien8752

The proletariat wanted to bring you the flame of revolution and these were the tools. :-)

That's obvious, but the details of the construction are far from obvious. Winding a toroidal transformer through the PCB is another of their quirks. Integrated planar magnetics done their way. :-)

Best regards, Piotr

Reply to
Piotr Wyderski

" snipped-for-privacy@bid.nes" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@googlegroups.com:

Naaah... It would have a CSA cert sticker on it then.

snip

Reply to
DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno

Copper tracks bonded to a board will crack if the board is flexed too much, wiring is much more forgiving. By separating out the 'support' function and the 'connection' function, the designers can optimise both. One long-lasting brand of domestic radio used an aluminium panel with the components soldered on both sides to copper pins through plastic insulating rivets; that company also did Government work.

Wired circuits are a lot more repairable than printed ones, although that might not be a factor in military use, where failure can result in total destruction from external causes.

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~ 
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply) 
www.poppyrecords.co.uk
Reply to
Adrian Tuddenham

This one looks like it could be somewhat high-voltage circuitry.

In all cases, these are likely VERY low-volume production aerospace designs, from WAY back, when any new technology was not trusted. They might even be one-off prototypes, and after testing were reduced to more practical construction techniques. I have certainly seen similar construction in US-made aerospace prototypes, too. One issue was in the "old days" it could take months to get a PC board designed, with hand- made artwork with Rubylith and crepe tape, while such prototypes like your videos could be whipped up in a shop in a couple days.

I have a Honeywell Alert airborne computer that was originally designed for the X15 project (supersonic plane, 1959 - 1968) that was only flown on the last few X15 flights. It used multilayer PC boards with all signal traces buried in the interior, with IC's on both sides of the board. Also, the 6 boards are connected to the motherboard by flex-print ribbon cables. So, the boards cannot be removed from the main chassis. But, they can be unclamped from the thermal conduction system and opened like a book. They were apparently worried about intermittent contacts between daughter boards and motherboard. But, then the CPU is connected to the memory with D-style connectors. Maybe since that was done with resilient cables, there would not be the stresses between rigid components pressing on the connectors. Anyway, it just seemed like a pretty strange way to build things.

Jon

Reply to
Jon Elson

Is that because plated holes hold the pads down? Or because solder on both sides holds the lead better, in which case it doesn't have to be plated through?

Reply to
Tom Del Rosso

The hole plating is what turns a fragile joint into a very rugged strong joint.

piglet

Reply to
piglet

That piece is probably from the 1980s.

Reply to
bitrex

Plus the fillet at the bottom of the hole. Works almost like an eyelet without the unreliability. ;)

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--
Dr Philip C D Hobbs 
Principal Consultant 
ElectroOptical Innovations LLC / Hobbs ElectroOptics 
Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 
Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 

http://electrooptical.net 
http://hobbs-eo.com
Reply to
Phil Hobbs

If it moves, or if the board flexes, the track will break away from it. Wire connections will flex and remain connected - as long as they aren't flexed so much that they work-harden.

--
~ Adrian Tuddenham ~ 
(Remove the ".invalid"s and add ".co.uk" to reply) 
www.poppyrecords.co.uk
Reply to
Adrian Tuddenham

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