An $11 trillion global hydrogen energy boom is coming.

Overproduction can be sold as EV charging. In the future, EVs can communic ate with charging stations for amount of power delivered based on time of u se and cost. ChaDeMo already have the communication capabilities, not sure about CCS. For that reason, i don't see CCS replacing ChaDeMo completely.

If Apple is using the water loop to cool chips, they need cold intake water and will discharge warm water. That doesn't sound useful to me. It would degrade the temperature of the municipal hot water. You can't efficiently heat a building or a house or a shower with tepid water. Maybe a swimming pool.

There is a lot of low-differential heat around, but nobody seems to have found a way to use it.

Heat pumps to get rid of excess low-grade heat?

But where does the heat ultimately go?

Apple certainly wouldn't want to intake cooling water at 70C. Or discharge it that high either.

Natural gas sounds increasingly appealing.

icate with charging stations for amount of power delivered based on time of use and cost. ChaDeMo already have the communication capabilities, not sur e about CCS. For that reason, i don't see CCS replacing ChaDeMo completely.

Yes, natural gas is good, but the problem is the methane with it.

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power storage capacity, nearly 150 times the current U.S. installed lithiu m-ion battery storage base, according to Mitsubishi Power

elopment needed to support distribution of this energy source. Fuel cells a re far enough along for them to start getting ready.

funding to support innovative hydrogen and fuel cell research and developm ent (R&D), infrastructure supply chain development and validation, and cost analysis activities. This funding opportunity announcement (FOA) builds up on existing efforts funded by DOE's Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Technologies Off ice to reduce cost, improve performance, and strengthen a domestic supply c hain for hydrogen and fuel cell technologies and applications.

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the idea is to cool the internal cooling loop with heatpumps that dump the heat in the district heating system

Of course it's mostly methane. Which is mostly hydrogen. And it's cheap and plantiful and easy to distribute and store. An ideal fuel.

The Google data center in Finland take in cold lake water, dump computer heat into it and the exhaust water is used for district heating, apparently through a heat pump.

They also bought the full electric production of a wind farm for a decade or two. The wind farm runs without subsidies.

It needs a power source, too, to pump heat uphill. Sounds very green and very inefficient.

The steam turbine cooling water can be used as a heat source for the absorbtion heat pump, which operates with the same principle as the gas fired fridges in recreational vehicles.

You have to convert the heat to a higher temperature than the environment to get rid of it. One alternative is to dump it to the warm air, but at costal regions, you can dump it into the sea.

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in funding to support innovative hydrogen and fuel cell research and devel opment (R&D), infrastructure supply chain development and validation, and c ost analysis activities. This funding opportunity announcement (FOA) builds upon existing efforts funded by DOE's Hydrogen and Fuel Cell Technologies Office to reduce cost, improve performance, and strengthen a domestic suppl y chain for hydrogen and fuel cell technologies and applications.

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I'd expect that Apple really wants to make cold water, not heat. Chips get faster when they are cold.

Using a 100C sink for the dump side of a chiller heat pump doesn't sound like the best way to make cold water.

That makes sense, but they would want to minimize their dump temperature, so the district system would get lukewarm water from them. The system still needs more heat pumps to boost the temperature to useful values. It's a little better than pumping up from lake temps, I guess. Maybe not.

What do they pay per KWH? If it's high enough, the farm doesn't need a subsidy. What do they do when there's no wind?

There are some insanely expensive high-morality green systems around.

On Saturday, 12 December 2020 at 08:30:14 UTC-8, Ed Lee wrote: ...

cate with charging stations for amount of power delivered based on time of use and cost. ChaDeMo already have the communication capabilities, not sure about CCS. For that reason, i don't see CCS replacing ChaDeMo completely.

The CCS protocol has no limitations to prevent V2G.

In the last few days VW and Hyundai made announcements that their cars woul d support bidirectional charging.

Providing demand side control for unidirectional charging is even easier an d could be done with the primitive J1772 protocol in the EVSE.

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nicate with charging stations for amount of power delivered based on time o f use and cost. ChaDeMo already have the communication capabilities, not su re about CCS. For that reason, i don't see CCS replacing ChaDeMo completely .

But no provision either. ChaDeMo has full CAN communications.

uld support bidirectional charging.

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and could be done with the primitive J1772 protocol in the EVSE.

Vehicle needs to talk to charger with enough information. Hard to do with primitive J1772, which is just voltage and duty cycles.

On Saturday, 12 December 2020 at 11:53:43 UTC-8, Ed Lee wrote: ...

primitive J1772, which is just voltage and duty cycles.

Agreed, that's what I said. But even with that constraint there are some va luable behaviours that are possible.

J1772 can control the charge rate or even stop it, the power being consumed can be measured. You don't need any more for just simple control assuming an intelligent EVSE with an internet connection.

There are EVSEs available that will use the limited capabilities of J1772 t o manage charging; to for example, share the available power with other car s or loads in the house to avoid overloads, or to limit charging to times w hen the costs are lower. There are pilot programs to allow control from the utility to manage the loads over a larger region.

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th primitive J1772, which is just voltage and duty cycles.

valuable behaviours that are possible.

ed can be measured. You don't need any more for just simple control assumin g an intelligent EVSE with an internet connection.

to manage charging; to for example, share the available power with other c ars or loads in the house to avoid overloads, or to limit charging to times when the costs are lower. There are pilot programs to allow control from t he utility to manage the loads over a larger region.

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Yes, it's possible to do it all from the EVSE side, but the problem is that the EVSE does not know what car is connected to it. For example, i might allow a Tesla to discharge (feeding the grid) to 50%, but would not want a Leaf to do that. ChaDeMo can tell the EVSE what is connected to it, CCS or J1772 can't.

One of the muinicpal pools here takes waste heat from the freezers in neighbouring shopping centre, when there's not enough heat a school on the other side shares some heat from a wood-fired boiler.

ultimately it escapes into the environment.

On Saturday, 12 December 2020 at 13:52:25 UTC-8, Ed Lee wrote: ...

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at the EVSE does not know what car is connected to it. For example, i might allow a Tesla to discharge (feeding the grid) to 50%, but would not want a Leaf to do that. ChaDeMo can tell the EVSE what is connected to it, CCS or J1772 can't.

J1772 doesn't allow bidirectional charging anyway so it's not an issue - th ere wouldn't be any discharge.

CCS does not currently provide the control for V2X (bidirectional charging) but the fact that VW, Hyundai and others have already announced support in their cars indicates it is on the way. It doesn't require any hardware mod ifications as a bidirectional datalink already exists in CCS.

I suspect that Chademo may have virtually died out by then.