As I understand it the _carrier_ for the planetary gears is independently driven.
...Jim Thompson
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| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
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| E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave
Start? I doubt it. I had a 63 bug and I could run the ignition off a 6V lantern battery. But I had to push it to start it.
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Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com
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The Three Laws of Thermodynamics:
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Too late. Thet have to deal with it in hybrid cars already.
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Paul Hovnanian mailto:Paul@Hovnanian.com
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Very funny, Scotty. Now beam down my pants!
The electric part of a hybrid is more about torques assist than than total power. Horsepower (torque*speed) matters a lot when you're talking about the difference between 120mph and 140 mph. Torque matters off the line, where most drivers sense peformance. Things that offer low-end torque are under-square big-block gas engines, diesel engines, and DC motors. AC synchronous motors too, properly driven (basically a DC brushless reassembled). Oh, and Grant's semi-right about 42VDC being a "safe" voltage. I can picture UL waiting in the wings, rubbing its hands together, just waiting to hold the auto industry hostage - I mean, go to the wall for consumers :-)
In the same time frame,a guy I worked with kept checking out the large (about 2 " D x 6 "L) cells to run his Austin Healy. Worked fine until he got fired.
I used to "run" with my '61 Renault Dauphine, jump in and pop the clutch to start it... did that for two months until batteries went on sale at Sears ;-)
Also used to stop it with the hand brake until I could afford the wheel cylinder re-build kits.
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, P.E. | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC\'s and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona Voice:(480)460-2350 | |
| E-mail Address at Website Fax:(480)460-2142 | Brass Rat |
| http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
America: Land of the Free, Because of the Brave
He said "A" cells. I think those were mongo cells, like the #6 or so. lessee...
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Like a modern lantern battery - scroll down about 4/5 of the page, to "Table of historical battery sizes".
But I could see that much battery working, with a motor/starter the size you'd see on a '60s bug. It doesn't have to provide the big amps for very long, you know. :-)
I was amazed the time I had to call out for a jump start, and the guy grabbed a thing from the cab of his truck, about as big as a lunchbox, but thinner, and jump- started the car. with it.
But, as was explained to me, starting current for 2-3 seconds isn't many total amp-hours; all the thing needs is a low internal resistance. :-)
Was poking around inside one the other day. Magnificent demonstration of modern engineering capability. I wouldn't have one given unless it was in warranty. They are massively, massively complex. Last week my sister had to pay the equiv of $2400 for replacement of the "engine control computer" on her 4 year old car. This was a trivial PCB, OEM cost maybe $20. I dread to think of the replacement cost of that huge inverter module or battery pack etc, etc. Prius, nice idea in theory but not the direction we should be heading.
You could sweet-talk someone at the dealership into disappearing a shop manual for you. ;-)
Or, you might try the public library. I once found a wiring diagram for a '75 Plymouth Gran Fury, so you never know. (some branch of the LA,CA library system.)
Viewed from a distance it appears that is exactly what is happening. When 42V was first introduced there was a flurry of semiconductor work, particularly MOSFETs. That did seem to hurry a generation of MOSFETS in the 60-75V range that were scooped up by EV people at least but since it wasn't followed through on in automotive the attention appears to have turned back to lower voltages. That's the only really lasting effect I've seen. There was some work on fuses (again the EV world would have liked to see fuses in automotive prices) but only Littlefuse seem to have produced anything.
Robert
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That reminds me. My wife use to work at an auto admissions. One day some one drives up in line to test their car. They had a string or what looked like a string coming out from under the hood and around the drivers door window. that is how the driver controlled his accelerator..
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Real Programmers Do things like this.
http://webpages.charter.net/jamie_5
The engine drives the carrier with the outer ring driving the wheels and the sun-gear driving a motor-generator (referred to as MG1). There is no mechanical ratio changing (Some higher performance Toyota models do have two fixed ratios to provide the required speed range but not the Prius).
The engine is run at full throttle under most conditions and its power output is controlled by varying its speed.
For example if MG1 is held stationery the engine drives the wheels with a ratio similar to top gear of a conventional car (suitable for medium to high-speed driving). If MG1 allowed to be driven by the engine the engine speed increases, producing more power, then MG1, acting as a generator produces power that is fed to the other motor generator (MG2) to provide more torque to the wheels - this is similar to running in low gear and is used for accelerating or hill-climbing.
MG1 can even be run in reverse and fed power from MG2 (acting as a generator). This forces the engine speed lower than in the first example and is similar to overdrive - this is for cruising.
The sun-planet gearing allows about 70% of the torque from the engine to drive the wheels directly with the other 30% driving the MG1.
MG1 is used as a motor to start the engine and when the car is stopped but the engine is still running MG1 will run in the reverse - this only occurs for short periods or when the engine is cold as the engine is usually stopped when the car is stationery. There are other unusual conditions such as when the car is moving but the engine is not running - MG1 then has to rotate at a suitable speed and direction to keep this state.
Another unusual condition is when driving in reverse - MG2 provides the traction force but if the engine is running it is actually attempting to propel the car forwards!
MG2 can also act a generator during braking, returning energy back to the battery - in fact under normal conditions the friction brakes are not used until the car gets down to 7mph!
One of the goals of this arrangement is to allow power to transfer efficiently trough the mechanical path (about 97% efficient) when possible rather than through the electro-mechanical path (only about
70-80% efficient). It also allows the electrical components to be sized only for that path (one 30kW and one 50KW unit) rather than the full engine plus battery power which would require a 60kW plus an 80kW unit.
There is a fair amount of detailed information around on the web describing the design e.g.
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gives an overview.
One of the most detailed is "Development of New-Generation Hybrid System THS II - Drastic Improvement of Power Performance and Fuel Economy" by some Toyota engineers - Document SAE 2004-01-0064. It was freely available last year but I can't find a free link to it now though.
I think it is technically impressive and it must have the highest power consumer electronics currently available - where else do you have sophisticated electronics controlling 500V at 100Amps in something you can buy for just over $20,000?
Michael snipped-for-privacy@QmQhQiQmQsQ.QcQoQ.QuQkQ posted to sci.electronics.design:
42 volts seems like a dumb choice to me, there is at least a trillion dollars invested in 48 V systems. Leverage what is already well understood technology (cheap).
Key in cars is that the voltage has a very wide range in use. A nominal '48v' system for car use, would have to deal with a voltage range from perhaps 30v, to 60v. The upper end in particular, takes you above the 50v maximum allowed in some countries as a 'safe' maximum voltage before more stringent safety measures come into play, and above the maximum working voltage for a lot of 48v industrial systems. The '42 volt' system, actually has a maximum voltage in use, of 49.3v, making it 'spot on', for a lot of existing 48v kit. They _have_ gone with a system that uses 'understood technology'.
It's still difficult to find stock of small automotive-style fuses rated for >32VDC.
Best regards, Spehro Pefhany
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"it\'s the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
No, it wasn't the one in your ref. The cell was cylindrical, 1.5V, and I think about 6 to 7 inches tall and 3 or so inches in diameter. As I understand it, it was used in the early radios before people had line power to their homes. The cells in use at that time were, A, B and C. simple enough! The A cells were used for filemetn, the B cells for bias and the C cell for plate voltages.
I bought my first A cell when I was 9 to power the headlight of a soapbox racer I had built. I haven't seen one sold in a long time.
So called phase shift gears are state of the art in many technical disciplines. You can learn more about it from:
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This type of gear can be also used to vary the phase angle between two shafts running on the same speed. In one of my early developments I used this technique to vary the strokevolume of a pair of piston pumps at runtime, simply by changing their phase angle from zero to 180deg. Today this is solved by applying two servomotors using their resolver signal to adjust the phase angle.
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