Renewable Energies

There are various costs involved in putting up a wind farm. Some of it

- the cost of the turbines and mounting them - is mostly the same for

100 turbines in 10 places or 1000 in one place. But other parts are per location - all the time and bureaucracy of buying the land and getting the permission, dealing with the local residents complaints about a big ugly wind farm, making the infrastructure for building the stuff, getting the power lines to connect to the grid, etc. I don't know quite how these balance, but it would not surprise me if the single 1000 turbine location is significantly faster and cheaper to get in place than 10 locations of 100 turbines.

And when you are doing offshore wind farms you have more effort on the infrastructure, but much lower costs on the permissions and land purchase.

Does Tesla pay you to advertise for them?

On Monday, November 19, 2018 at 1:44:34 AM UTC-6, snipped-for-privacy@downunder.com wr ote:

rote:

upswing, the cost to the end user is below the market rate for other energy types, what is wrong with trying to switch over? Maybe there are governme nt subsidies helping with the price structures, but as renewables ramp up t he prices will continue to drop. It shouldn't be a problem to phase out th e subsidies as this happens. Why would anyone be opposed to this?

rgy market to be useful. Certainly they can supplement and replace a signi ficant portion of energy sources in the US and many other places. Interest ingly enough one of the areas where wind energy is on a major upswing is in Texas, home of the Permian basin and much of the US refining industry. Fu nny how things work out.

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constant source with little ability to adjust to demand. So do you factor in the peaking generators to adjust the supply to the load?

tion. So we need alternate energy sources and Nuclear can only fill its ni che.

k in the early AM before solar has gotten to it's peak and in the late afte rnoon/early evening now after the solar peak.

Sure, you can do that, but you get a fraction of the total energy. Also, i n the winter the sun is not even up for an hour in the morning peak and the entire evening peak (my rates are peak from 6 to 9 AM and 5 to 8 PM). A b it hard to get much from a solar panel no matter which way it's pointed if the sun is not up.

Rick C.

Tesla referral code -+-+-

I would think 1000 unit farm would get a lot more scrutiny than 100 units. Those are just example numbers, but you get the idea. I know the solar fa rm they are putting in here is a bit of a deal because they picked one of t he remaining tracts of land large enough, 3,500 acres. This is displacing a fox hunt which has been going on for decades and will need to relocate to another county. I know a fox hunt sounds like small potatoes, but around here it is a bit of a deal. The point is smaller farms distributed a bit m ore widely would not be an issue really.

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Not really advertising for them, for me. Both the referred and myself get benies if they use the link. I used a referral to get unlimited Supercharg ing when I bought my car.

Rick C.

Tesla referral code -+-++

Nuclear reactors, at least PWRs, have some issues that make it undesirable to throttle them. That's why they are used for the base load, while gas and water turbines make up for the variations.

I don't remember the exact reasons. Something to do with transient concentrations of fission products, if I remember well. I have a description of the French PWRs somewhere that goes into some detail about this. I'll see if I can find it again.

Jeroen Belleman

Maybe - it is very difficult to generalise on such issues. (Well, it is /easy/ to generalise - but difficult to do so usefully and correctly!) And it is certainly difficult to predict who will shout the loudest in complaint about having wind farms (or solar farms) in their back yard.

I didn't know there was any fox hunt tradition outside of the UK (where no one sane puts up a solar farm anyway).

Fair enough, then.

For the UK you can see the demand curves and generation curves at

and the datasets can be downloaded for your own processing.

When I quickly processed the wind generation stats for one year I was surprised to find a very simple rule of thumb for the probability of having wind power. If the peak output is P, then the probability that there will be xP or more of power is roughly x (for x in 0..1!).

Hence there will be less than 1% of wind power output on 3.5 days per year. That destroys the greenwash that "if the wind isn't blowing /here/, it is blowing /there/".

I ought to repeat that with a later dataset, since more wind capacity has been added.

A too-sudden ramp down creates iodine/xenon poisoning, which can shut down a reactor for days.

--

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 

lunatic fringe electronics

mandag den 19. november 2018 kl. 02.26.28 UTC+1 skrev snipped-for-privacy@ieee.org:

fairly close to the places that are going to consume power.

re building now is offshore farms of several MW turbines.

s, with a couple per power station. The most recent plants have moved up 70

0MW turbines.

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er.

so this little city with a 400MW electricity + 400MW district heating coal fired power plant just need to find room for 400 2MW wind turbines and they need to be placed something like +200meter apart to not interfere with eac h other

Birds are a nuisance anyhow.

--

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 

lunatic fringe electronics

Yup, if you lose the cooling water things will melt, and the control rods won't help.

--

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc 
picosecond timing   precision measurement  

jlarkin att highlandtechnology dott com 
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

For sure, but that's what we do here, no? We discuss things that are outside our field of expertise as if we are experts. I know JL loves to do that.

I try to talk about things I have some knowledge of, but you are right, I don't actually know which is better for getting approvals.

Plenty of places on the east coast have fox hunts. Fairfax, just next to Wash DC, used to have a fox hunt until one where the fox ran into a shopping center. They moved it further out to another country next year.

I guess I don't really need to add another one here. lol

Rick C.

After emergency shutdown, the decaying isotopes produces 7 % heat compared to full reactor thermal power, assuming there is one year since last reactor fuel load. An easy way to estimate this heat buildup is to take the power plant electric power and divide it by 5

You must remove this heat from the core for at least a weak, later on this requirement drops.

The removal of this heat failed in Fukushima, when the diesel generators became wet during tsunami. .

em fairly close to the places that are going to consume power.

are building now is offshore farms of several MW turbines.

nes, with a couple per power station. The most recent plants have moved up

700MW turbines.

ralia

ller.

l fired power plant just need to find room for 400 2MW wind turbines and th ey need to be placed something like +200meter apart to not interfere with e ach other

Let's be realistic. The 400 2MW wind turines aren't going to be place close enough to the city limits that the greater-than-200-metre spacing is going to be a problem. If they were placed in a circular ring on that spacing, t hey'd be spread out in a circle with a 12.7 km radius from the city centre.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

That depends on what things melt, and in which order, which can be figured into the original design.

US power reactors seem to be spin-offs of Rickover's original design for nuclear submarines, which had to be compact. Commercial nuclear reactors didn't need to meet the same design constraints, but nobody wanted to pay for new design.

--
Bill Sloman, Sydney

I don't know about getting approvals either - so that's almost all the qualifications we need for an argument in s.e.d. All that is missing is for someone to blame the democrats for the windmills, or to deny that fossil energy affects the climate.

I guess that wherever the British went over the centuries, they took foxes and fox hunting with them - and some places kept the habit.

There are duration curves for the Nordic region at

page 3. The curves show one year of 8760 hours (365x24).

The output from a single site drops quite fast, but for each Nordic country much slower. The curve for the entire Nordic region drops even slower. The other graph on that page shows the variation relative to the average output and there is an enlargement of the last 200 hours, clearly showing the averaging effect. The output of the region drops radically about 24 hours from the end. Clearly the larger area helps in reducing the risk of calm in the whole region. .

Unfortunately much like cricket! I used to think baseball was a slow game until I saw cricket!

Rick C.

Tesla referral code +-

Blame cricket specifically on the English, rather than the British in general (fox hunting was popular throughout the UK, not just in England).

And you can blame baseball on the English too, I believe.

According to unofficial sources, the test was originally assigned to the Sosnovi Bor RBMK site close to Leningrad. However, they thought it was too dangerous and they refused to do it.

The test was then assigned to the Tsernobyl RBMK site, which either did not understand the risks or were too afraid to object the Moscow demands.