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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
wrote:

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Oh, ye, who only think in devices... TANH is a mathematical expression
;-)
        
                                        ...Jim Thompson
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| James E.Thompson                                 |    mens     |
| Analog Innovations                               |     et      |
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, July 14, 2017 at 12:35:45 PM UTC-4, Jim Thompson wrote:
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thout the
y the output graph. What sort of circuit is it?
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To piglet, I think they pull tanh out of the ideal diode equation.  

(e^x-e^-x)/(e^x+e^-x)... but I don't recall how.  

George h.  
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 11:34:00 -0700 (PDT), George Herold

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George, Your equation _is_ the definition of TANH.

  <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperbolic_function

        
                                        ...Jim Thompson
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 13:55:36 -0700, Jim Thompson

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Thought I had scrawled that out before, found it...

   <http://www.analog-innovations.com/DiffPairMath-JT.pdf>

        
                                        ...Jim Thompson
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, July 14, 2017 at 5:09:08 PM UTC-4, Jim Thompson wrote:
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OK, thanks.  So it does come out of a diff pair like  
piglet said.  

George h.  
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On 14/07/2017 17:35, Jim Thompson wrote:
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Ach so!

I wanted something I could poke into white proto breadboard :)

piglet




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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Thu, 13 Jul 2017 14:37:09 -0700, Jim Thompson

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Well, don't show us how it works.

Anything with hysteresis must store an internal state.


--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing   precision measurement  

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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Thu, 13 Jul 2017 16:45:39 -0700, John Larkin

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Once embellished, it will be shown.  First passes always have bugs.

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But doesn't require feedback to store that state.
        
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Thu, 13 Jul 2017 16:54:31 -0700, Jim Thompson

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Initial conditions can be problematic.

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, 14 July 2017 03:46:34 UTC+1, snipped-for-privacy@notreal.com  wrote:
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t the

Just think about how an iron core implements hysteresis and copy that. That
's what mine does. Jim's has way more gain. I'm not familiar with his diagr
ams though.


NT

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Thu, 13 Jul 2017 20:15:12 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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At T0, what direction is the flux?

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, 14 July 2017 23:17:41 UTC+1, snipped-for-privacy@notreal.com  wrote:
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Now there's a question lacking the necessary details.
Alternate reply: in some unknown random core with unknown history, it's in that direction ->


NT

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 15:38:49 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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Think about it.  At zero it's zero... not a problem.
        
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, 14 July 2017 23:46:02 UTC+1, Jim Thompson  wrote:
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I was always told transformer cores can have residual magnetism. ICBW though, magnetics is not my thing. I'm more into efficiency.


NT


Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Friday, July 14, 2017 at 3:46:02 PM UTC-7, Jim Thompson wrote:
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At zero, we'd LIKE it to be zero.   Remanent field in big iron promotes saturation
and is behind a lot of light dimming events.   A fluorescent tube can
accidentally rectify well enough to saturate a ballast- then hot tar comes dripping
from the fixture if the fuse doesn't go first....

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 15:38:49 -0700 (PDT), snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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You're talking about a bistable multivibrator.  The subject at hand is
a Schmidt trigger.  Knowing the input conditions of a Schmidt trigger
one knows it's state.  That's not true of a widget that requires a
storage element.

Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 23:13:14 -0400, snipped-for-privacy@notreal.com wrote:

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In general, you have to know the *history* of its input conditions to
know its state.


--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc

lunatic fringe electronics  


Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 20:21:31 -0700, John Larkin

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Only sequential logic.  A Schmitt is purely combinatorial.  It's
outputs are a function of its input(s) - only.  Need feedback to make
it work.


Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
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Okay, so what's the state of a Schmitt trigger when its input lies between  
the rising and falling thresholds.


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Which a Schmitt trigger has.

Tim

--  
Seven Transistor Labs, LLC
Electrical Engineering Consultation and Contract Design
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Re: Hysteresis without Feedback
On Fri, 14 Jul 2017 23:47:02 -0500, "Tim Williams"

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Do pay attention.


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