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There is a popular book Wheat Belly pub'd in 2011 auth'd by Wm Davis, cardiologist, who says modern wheat cultivars are 'drastically' different from the wheat of 50 y ago in terms of the metabolic impact of its amylopectin A starch, which he says has a higher glycemic index than sugar.
That GI number is supported by a Harvard study* which showed white bread at 75 while sucrose was 65 and fructose 15 while glucose was of course 100, the index.
*
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Glycemic index for 60+ foods - Measuring carbohydrate effects can help glucose management
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Mike Easter
Reply to
Mike Easter
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This is precisely what my pre-diabetic course taught.
I eat strawberries and cream with some cane sugar and feel better than when I eat bread, by miles
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
"sucrose" is a mixture of glucose and fructose.
GI index isnt the only measure though: total carbohydrates is another.
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Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as  
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
Actually sucrose is a disaccharide of the two mono/s, so it starts out chemically bonded, which bond is easily and quickly cleaved/ hydrolyzed/ in the presence of sucrase; not so fast if there is no sucrase. Normal human beans have no shortage of sucrase.
Well, of course; but now we're sorta talking about coulombs vs amps.
The problem w/ high GI is that it wants to make the blood sugar rise 'aggressively' which invites metabolic effects to lower it and that glucose swing business on the metabolism is what Davis says invites /more/ 'wheat' behavior. Wheat eating begets wheat eating begets obesity via too many calories via the carbs.
There's another argument that healthy fats and other non-carb calories don't engender that kind of eating begetting eating begetting excess calories.
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Mike Easter
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Mike Easter
Oh dear ... what have I started :D
No. It's good that people is talking about foodstuffs and health.
Here is easy checklist for healthy eating:
Is it a plant?
yes | no | | | - Eat it. | - Don't eat it.
Some sauerkraut is not that bad or some other fermented stuff. But just a little and not everyday.
If you need to choose some oxalate drink ... tea rather than coffee ...
And remember to fast regularly. It's rather important thing that has been bashed out from our excessive way of life.
But if you stop sugars, grains, starches and such nonsense you will be just fine.
Reply to
Bud Spencer
Absolutely. If you eat enough fat it wont make you fat, it just means you not want to eat anything as you can feel slightly sick.
My experience is that bread is like chinese food. You feel full and an hour later you feel hungry. Starch is physically addictive.
Low carb high meat high fat diet works because it depresses appetite.
Add in enough veg for roughage and vitamins and you do not need to eat any carbs whatsoever.
As the lecturer on the course said 'carbohydrates are the only food humans do not need for survival'
--
?Progress is precisely that which rules and regulations did not foresee,? 

  ? Ludwig von Mises
Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
Pretty bad dietary advice. Likely to lead to vitamins deficincies.
If it is a plant dont eat it (a) if its a cereal (b) if it comes from below the ground (c) it tastes really sweet.
Fasting is massively good for you for a day or two
Yes. Carbs are the killers.
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
taste is a poor indicator Strawberries for example are have a low GI (40) Raspberries are even better (30) see almost back on topic :-)
Where Low is 70
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Reply to
Alister
Indeed & I must be doing something right my HbA1c at diagnosis was 107 with metformin & small doses of insulin my recent results were 37,36,37 & the docs are complaining I am too low :-)
No white bread, no white pasta & no sugar fizzy drinks, beyond that i don't fuss too much any-more
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I joined scientology at a garage sale!!
Reply to
Alister
With such good dietary behavior, maybe you can get rid of that insulin.
Or at least do a 'therapeutic trial' (metformin only) and watch/monitor your blood sugar a little while. Temporarily trade some finger pricks for needle sticks :-)
That's the econo way; nowadays there are clever devices for measuring bloodsugar w/o a prick. Since the trial would only be temporary, the finger prick route makes the most sense.
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Mike Easter
Reply to
Mike Easter
Well there is hope for me. I am pre diabetic and a tad thick about the middle
I am eally truing to get the starch out and it is almost working. It is harder then giving up smoking, though.
--
"The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow witted  
man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest  
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
If it's type II you shouldn't be on insulin anyway.
I was under the impressions that metformin was for type II and insulin for type I
Oh. It appears it is prescribed.
I would have though that a decent diet should allow you to drop the insulin at leats, if not the metformin
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"If you don?t read the news paper, you are un-informed. If you read the  
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
to be honest I haven't been bothering with the insulin much recently (BG tests creeping up a bit but that should pleas the docs :-( ) although with the results i had i tend towards "if it ain't broke don't fix it" I try to test regularly anyway (while on insulin i get test strips on prescription so another reason not to change :-) )
over the past year i have been undergoing treatment for bowel cancer so the diabetes has taken a back seat anyway
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Eureka! 
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Reply to
Alister
That's a pretty high HbA1c, presuming it is mmol/mol, that's about the same as 12% by the old scheme. 6.5% gets you the diagnosis.
Some people are inclined to be insulin resistant, which includes both endogenous and exogenous. The metformin helps mitigate that. There are various factors which influence the resistance and metformin isn't the only mitigator. Reducing body fat helps as does exercise.
So, the diabetic, incl type 2, may have some deficiency of insulin output and some insulin resistance.
The whole idea behind all of the strategies is optimizing control for the individual patient.
--
Mike Easter
Reply to
Mike Easter
You are lucky to be alive. The two people I knew who had that are not.
--
"And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch". 

Gospel of St. Mathew 15:14
Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
Fortunately if caught it is actually one of the most treatable. problem is people don't go to the Drs Early enough or the Drs Poo-Poo (pun intended) the possibility if you are young.
Don't Ignore toilet habit changes & return the test if you are sent one!
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a balloon and thereby cause a whistling sound on the streets.
Reply to
Alister
Sadly most dietary advice seems to boil down to "if it tastes nice, it's bad for you; if it tastes vile, it's good for you".
Reply to
NY
No! I am allowed as many pork chops and steaks as I like!
Full fat cream milk and yoghurt!
CHEESE!
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its been subverted by the people it tried to warn you about. 
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Reply to
The Natural Philosopher
Contains lactose a sugar,
Reply to
ken young
very very little - about 1% by weight, and then only some cheeses
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conspirators see right wing conspiracies everywhere"
Reply to
The Natural Philosopher

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