battery charger circuit overload

Hello,

I have a battery charger here

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the circuit is in two phase:

- BAttery A and B charging BAttery C and D

- BAttery C and D charging BAttery A and B

1) once the opto couplers are on, the 5amp fuse on battery A and B just blows up. (it should be about 1.5amp) short circuit somewhere... 2) The 100 ohm resistors in the optocoupler work in real , but in the simulation is does not. The circuit work if I wire one phase at a time, but when the two phases are wired, then this is where I get the fuse burning problem

any suggestions?

(this is similar to a thread I posted earlier)

thanks

K
Reply to
lerameur
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here

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You need to explain moe about exactly what you want this circuit to do.

You schematic seems to have some errors, eg you seem to be missing a resistor in series with the opto isolator near battery D and the phototransistor side of U46 should have the collector more positive than then the emitter.

You havn't told us what sort of batterys these are but I'm assuming that the battery capacity is a few amp-hours or more. From the schematic your batterys are 12volts so I'm guessing lead acid.

If one battery is fully charged and another battery is discharged. and the MOSFET linking them is turned fully on then tens of amps will flow initally.

Why do you think that only 1.5amp should flow?

Besides one of you optocouplers being the wrong way round on your schematic is the voltage source the same in the schematic and real life? Is the spice model an accurate representation of your optocouplers? If your voltage source is 12volts then 100 ohms is too low for many types of optocouplers, the working life will be considerably shortened. Read the datasheet for the max recommended current.

Bob

Reply to
Bob

lCircuit.gif

Hi Bob,

I posted the circuit with the current showing. I also have 5 volt coming off to the optocoupler. I tried 11v and forgot to remove it. The 5v is coming out from a pic, cant get more then that from a micro controller hehe. As you can see the current is 1.3 amp, then gets divided by the two batteries for the charging process. Yes they are 4 sealed lead acid batteries, 12v, 7 amp/hour I tried swapping the U46 emitter and collector but I was not getting anything decent, if you want I can post that result. hope I answered all your questions

thanks K

Reply to
lerameur

ullCircuit.gif

Oups forget to post the link:

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k
Reply to
lerameur

Oups forget to post the link:

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It is still unclear what you are trying to do, but I assume you are using multiple batteries to drive the 5 ohm load through D2-D5. But your full circuit shows the high current path for the batteries going through 1N4148 signal diodes, which cannot handle more than about 200 mA. It appears that the two batteries C and D are in series and they supply charging current to batteries A and B which are sort of in parallel. I see no current regulation or limiting other than the 5 ohm load. So you are discharging C and D while charging A and B, and driving a 5 ohm load with about 7 volts which will vary as the battery voltages change.

You really need to be specific about what you want to do. You may be much better off with SPDT relays to switch the batteries from supplying current to being charged. Use isolation diodes on each battery so only the one with highest voltage drives the load, until it drops enough for others to share. But you have to disconnect the battery when charging. Otherwise the higher charging voltage will drive the load. I'm assuming that you want to be able to drive the load with any one or all of the batteries, and select which ones to charge.

It is really confusing to understand why you are charging one set of batteries from another, and I don't see any load other than the 5 ohm resistor.

Paul

Reply to
Paul E. Schoen

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This is a small part of my project. Well if this part works great, if not I will by more solar panel. Any how here is the link where I got the circuit from:

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(4 battery switch)

It may not do as it says, but the circuit should work nevertheless.

thanks k

Reply to
lerameur

Groan, we can stop trying to figure out your crazy schematic now.

You need to learn two things:

1) Not everything on the web is true. 2) The principle of conservation of energy.

There is lots of nonsense about free energy on the web. You can't make a perpetual motion machine, a car that runs on water or a machine that will run a light bulb forever without external energy input.

You can safely assume that anything mentioning Nikola Tesla and free energy is a stupid hoax that won't work.

This scheme will not work.

If you don't believe this you need to try out the circuit shown on the bottom of the first page of that pdf. The one with two batterys and a light bulb in a loop.

Perferably try this with a couple of AA batterys and a torch bulb. I'm not sure you can be trusted to not hurt yourself messing with lead acid batterys.

The pdf claims that one battery will charge the other. It will not.

If you have the positive of one battery to the negative of the other then the sum of the voltages is 24 volts. You get 24 volts across the bulb. A 24volt bulb will discharge both the batterys.

If you have the batterys wired with opposite polarity eg batteryA+ to batteryB+, batteryB- to lamp, lamp to BatteryA- then the sum of the battery voltages is zero! The lamp does not light, one battery does not charge the other.

If one 12volt battery is slightly different voltage to the other you might get 0.5V across the lamp and a faint glow.

Once you have realised that the first page of the pdf is complete crap it should be obvious that all the rest is too.

It sounds like you have put a lot of time into this and spent a bit of money on parts. I suggest that before attempting any more design projects you read a really basic book on electronics, play with some AA batterys, bulbs and a voltmeter and figure out how volts add up round a circuit.

Bob

Reply to
Bob

Hi bob, well I am not going for perpetual motion here, I just want to make the circuit as in the simulation. even if in my circuit the series batteries are not fully charge, lets say in the worst case 11v, that would be 22v, enough to charge the other 12v battery. I have the thing working with relays, but relays are bulky noisy and slow. I understand you, the energy I use to switch the relays, the heat loss in the load and in the wires I am not gaining any energy.

I want to make my circuit work, it will not do what they say, but it should do what it should do, meaning switching batteries from series to parallel, and that I believe it is possible. . thanks k

Reply to
lerameur

There are too many errors and ASSumptions in the circuit descriptions and components even to begin criticism and correction. Some big crazies are:

  1. It says the 12 V batteries can be charged to 36 VDC. I think not...
  2. It says a fully discharged battery can be recharged in under one minute without any heating. Let's see. 7 amp-hour battery charged in 1 minute needs 60x7 amps = 420 amps. Boom!
  3. The author of the document states that the transformers used in the John Bedini circuit have an 8 ohm primary and 1000 ohm secondary, and then states that the voltage ratio is 125, when it is closer to 11. This is a common error among those who are clueless about electronics, and places suspicion on any other "facts" he may state.
  4. The ASSumption is that the "environment" supplies unlimited free "zero point" energy field (space-time continuum). The only way you can get "free" energy from the environment is if you are located in the path of a microwave beam. Of course, that would fry your brain, which may be what happened to these kooks.
  5. Part of the explanation involves electrons moving quickly on the surface of wires and then reaching a "bottleneck" when they attempt to enter the battery where the current is somehow carried by heavier lead ions whose inertia cause a build-up of voltage (and current).
  6. There is obvious confusion in the author's concept of current, voltage, energy, and power.
  7. It states that Nikola Tesla used four diodes, but I don't think there were any available during his lifetime, except perhaps crystal diodes or vacuum tubes.

I found an interesting website that adds more information to this concept/hoax.

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I liked the name PESwiki, as my initials are PES.

There was also an interesting discussion on Tesla's receivers, which introduced a negative-resistance device.

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But I don't think there is any evidence that Tesla belived in OU or free energy. It might be possible to transmit energy efficiently through the ionosphere, or tap into energy produced by the same mechanisms that make lightning, but that is a far cry from having a simple circuit tap into energy from quantum vacuum and the space-time continuum.

For the OP, the best way to put batteries in series and parallel is electromechanical relays. They are fast enough for any conceivable practical purpose, and should not be noisy enough to be a problem.

Paul

Reply to
Paul E. Schoen

Here is another web page by someone who constructed the same sort of circuit that the OP has, and got a similar result, with one of the batteries being overloaded. Also, the total state of charge after some time of playing ring-around-the-rosary with three batteries is shown to be diminished exactly as expected by conventional theory.

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Paul

Reply to
Paul E. Schoen

me

com/tesla1.htm

Paul, Like I said it is somewhat working with the relays. I think it is possible to make the circuit work without having all the super effect of free energy it is claiming for. The circuit is divided in two state, both state works individually but when they are combine there is a short. I think it has todo wih a bad conception rather then over unity as claimed. I dont believe either in it, other wise many people would have put it on the market obviously. I think it is an interesting project. I am just trying to convert the relay circuit into a non relay circuit using either opto coupler or mosfets.

K
Reply to
lerameur

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