why do they do this?

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ST makes a nice little LDO, super-low dropout with an aux Vbias
supply. Saves me from rolling my own with an opamp and a mosfet.

It's an ST1L08.

So why is the data sheet file  en.DM00123507.pdf ?

--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing   precision measurement  

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Re: why do they do this?
On Monday, May 18, 2020 at 7:41:34 PM UTC-4, John Larkin wrote:
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Who cares, it's a crappy regulator. And the lying bastards with their fake  
dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must be great
er than Vout + 1.5V. The GND current at no load of 35uA, sucks , as does th
at showy 80dB PSRR at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whol
e lot about PSRR. And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try  
getting 800mA out of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liqu
id nitrogen drip.


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Re: why do they do this?
On Mon, 18 May 2020 17:57:06 -0700 (PDT),
snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

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Lying? It's all over the data sheet. It's how they get the millivolts
of dropout. I do that when I make my own super-LDOs, power an opamp
from some higher voltage and over-drive an nfet follower down to
milliohms of Rds-on.

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I'm dropping a switched 1.8 to 1.5. That's 0.3 volts. Times 800 mA
would be 0.24 watts dissipated. Actually, I don't need that much
current to run a couple DRAM chips.

You sure are in a bad mood lately.



--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

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Re: why do they do this?
On Tuesday, May 19, 2020 at 2:01:09 PM UTC+10, jla...@highlandsniptechnolog
y.com wrote:
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ke dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must be gr
eater than Vout + 1.5V.  
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 at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whole lot about PSRR.  
And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try getting 800mA out  
of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liquid nitrogen drip.
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He's gradually working out that he's in the one country where Covid-19 is e
ventually going to have a good chance at killing him, and that he's in the  
age group where it's quite likely to succeed.

He can do all the wishful thinking he likes but the realisation that that's
 what's going to happen is gradually creeping up on him, and he doesn't lik
e it at all.

--  
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Re: why do they do this?
On Tuesday, May 19, 2020 at 1:08:33 AM UTC-4, Bill Sloman wrote:
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ogy.com wrote:
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fake dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must be  
greater than Vout + 1.5V.  
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RR at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whole lot about PSRR
. And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try getting 800mA ou
t of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liquid nitrogen drip
.
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 eventually going to have a good chance at killing him, and that he's in th
e age group where it's quite likely to succeed.
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's what's going to happen is gradually creeping up on him, and he doesn't l
ike it at all.

Okay- so you can now add psychology to all your other disqualifications.

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Re: why do they do this?
On Wednesday, May 20, 2020 at 1:01:07 AM UTC+10, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wr
ote:
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ology.com wrote:
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r fake dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must b
e greater than Vout + 1.5V.  
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PSRR at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whole lot about PS
RR. And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try getting 800mA  
out of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liquid nitrogen dr
ip.
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is eventually going to have a good chance at killing him, and that he's in  
the age group where it's quite likely to succeed.
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at's what's going to happen is gradually creeping up on him, and he doesn't
 like it at all.
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That was comedy, not psychology. Fred didn't get the joke.

--  
Bill Sloman, Sydney


Re: why do they do this?
On 5/19/2020 9:31 AM, snipped-for-privacy@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
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Not directly comparable to the ST1L08 but the Holtek HT75xx-1  
series is nice. Max Vin 30V, 100mA, 2.5uA ground current, 25mV  
drop-out. 16 different fixed output voltages from 2.1V to 12V  
with 3% tolerance. As usual with products originating in the  
East, the datasheet is rather sparse about details, but I've used  
them and they do what I want.

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I've noticed that lately with some regulars here, including a few  
who normally exhibit decent manners.

Re: why do they do this?

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Is it stable with low ESR caps? We use polymers or ceramics mostly.

We need so many goofy voltages that we usually buy adjustable
regulators for stock. The board that I'm doing now has a 24-channel
analog mux to BIST the power supplies, using the dreadful Xilinx
1-volt XADC that's inside their FPGAs. Free and worth it.

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Well, some never show any sign of manners. They are repulsive but
you've got to feel sorry for them, stuck being around themselves all
day.

There's a basically perfect -1 correlation between being obnoxious and
designing electronics.



--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc

Science teaches us to doubt.

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Re: why do they do this?
On 2020-05-19 09:50, snipped-for-privacy@highlandsniptechnology.com wrote:
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Well, now that Jim Thompson is apparently no longer with us. :(

He was a bit of a statistical outlier.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs


--  
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
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Re: why do they do this?
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Was that the guy who designed all the 2 digit LM series chips? What  
happened to him?

Re: why do they do this?
On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 2:44:49 PM UTC+10, Cydrome Leader wrote:
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ir fake dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must  
be greater than Vout + 1.5V.
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s
 PSRR at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whole lot about P
SRR. And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try getting 800mA
 out of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liquid nitrogen d
rip.
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You are thinking of Bob Widlar, and Wikipedia will tell you all you need to
  know. He seems to have drunk to much and died  relatively young -  aged  
53 - in 1991.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Widlar

Jim Thompson designed a bunch of chip for Motorola early on, and I had the  
dubious pleasure of getting a few of them to work. It wasn't easy, and ever
y last one of them got replaced by something that had been designed to do m
uch the same job either a bit better or bit more easily.

The MC14046 comes to mind. It's Jim's TTL MC4024 and MC4044 combined and ex
ecuted in CMOS by somebody else. It's still a conceptual mess but works wel
l enough to have lasted.

Jim's multiplier chips were much the same as the multiplier chips  Barry Gi
lbert put together for Analog Devices, but every last one of Barry's parts  
was easier to use than Jim's, and Barry kept on tinkering with them to make
 the better - faster or more accurate - for some years. I met Barry once wh
en I was working in the UK and he was going around talking to customers, es
sentially about new products that we weren't going to be buying.

Jim was an adequate journey man designer, and Bob and Barry were master cra
ftsmen. Bob seems to nave been a real virtuoso.

--  
Bill Sloman, Sydney

Re: why do they do this?
On 2020-05-21 00:44, Cydrome Leader wrote:
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He was more in the Motorola orbit back then, IIRC, but he was certainly  
the most accomplished IC designer in the group.  He disappeared a couple  
of years ago, after having been diagnosed with early-stage pancreatic  
cancer during tests for something else.  He said that he thought he had  
beaten it, but then just disappeared from the group.  His website  
subsequently disappeared as well.

Various folks have looked for an obituary, but nothing turned up.  (His  
full name was James Elbert Thompson, and he lived most recently in Queen  
Creek AZ.)  He was a bit of a chingada but designed a lot of interesting  
electronics and really helped keep the local leftists in check.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--  
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
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Re: why do they do this?
On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 4:26:50 PM UTC+10, Phil Hobbs wrote:
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<snip>

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The only one who did it for a livng.

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I didn't much like it when he found out my postal address in the Netherland's and threatened to send a couple of hit men to keep me in check.

His apologists claimed that he was just joking, but he persisted in his claim to have to reported me to the FBI for dangerously anti-American attitudes.

I'm certainly more left of centre than Jim was - you'd have to rabid to get further to the right - and I'm almost certainly to the left of Phil Hobbs.

This doesn't make me a leftist outside of the US. where they are plenty of peole who are much further to the left.

As for keeping me - or anybody else - "in check", Phil is fooling himself. In chess this means putting enough pressure on the king to force some kind of counter move to get it out of check, and I've not experienced anything like that.

I once - unwisely - took up John Larkin when he claimed that he couldn't find enough competent help, and suggested that I might be able to do some remote consulting for him.

John Larkin then behaved rather badly by passing on the e-mail to Jim, who proceeded to crow - here - about persuading John not to follow up.

He didn't have anything to crow about. John's passing on the e-mail to Jim would have been quite enough to put me right off the idea, anyway. You have to trust the people you work with to behave more or less properly, and John clearly couldn't be trusted.

--  
Bill Sloman, Sydney


Re: why do they do this?
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This all sounds familiar now- the IC designer in AZ. I didn't realize  
he's been gone for years now.

Re: why do they do this?
On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 2:26:50 AM UTC-4, Phil Hobbs wrote:
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:
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eir fake dropout specs while conveniently omitting the fact that Vbias must
 be greater than Vout + 1.5V.
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ts
B PSRR at 100 Hz. Battery operation usually doesn't care a whole lot about  
PSRR. And the thermal impedance specs are so bad, you just try getting 800m
A out of it with any kind voltage headroom without using a liquid nitrogen  
drip.
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d
  
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That's a bit of a laugh.  Suggesting that JT kept anyone in check with his  
delusional ranting is like suggesting Larkin tells the straight story of th
e coronavirus by his in depth analysis of the data and his knowledge of epi
demiology.  

JT may have done interesting design work, but when it came to politics he w
as a raving maniac.  

--  

  Rick C.

  --- Get 1,000 miles of free Supercharging
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Re: why do they do this?
On Tue, 19 May 2020 09:55:39 -0400, Phil Hobbs

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He was crabby and dismissive of people not as smart as he was, and
hostile to people that might have been smarter, but he was
occasionally helpful, and had a sense of humor, and was very brave at
the end.

--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing   precision measurement  

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Re: why do they do this?
On 2020-05-21 13:38, John Larkin wrote:
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When he wasn't busy accusing peoples' wives of immoral behaviour,  
threatening folks with lawsuits or bodily harm, or siccing the FBI on  
some deserving individuals. ;)

He was probably nice enough in person--we collaborated a couple of times  
but never met in person or even talked on the phone together.

I agree that he had guts and seems to have died very well.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

--  
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
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Re: why do they do this?
On Thu, 21 May 2020 14:07:29 -0400, Phil Hobbs

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Gosh, nobody's perfect.

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I used a version of his clever CD ignition (without his permission) as
a gain-switched laser driver. Nice circuit.

--  

John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
picosecond timing   precision measurement  

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Re: why do they do this?
On 2020-05-21 16:44, John Larkin wrote:
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I have a mirror of the last version of his web site at
<https://electrooptical.net/static/oldsite/www.analog-innovations.com/logo.html>.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
--  
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
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Re: why do they do this?
On 2020-05-21 17:39, Phil Hobbs wrote:
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Sorry, that's not where the interesting stuff links from.  Should be
<https://electrooptical.net/static/oldsite/www.analog-innovations.com/analog-innovations.html>

Cheers

Phil Hobbs
--  
Dr Philip C D Hobbs
Principal Consultant
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