Surplus electricity

Exactly! Of course, body politicus generally does not understand that.

The worst I heard was this: Water used to be unmetered in many parts of the Sacramento area. As in "free". Many residents had a 1" pipes which allowed for real gushers. One guy was letting it rip, driving a little turbine and running the massive fresh water discharge into the sewer. Horrible.

There are many nonsensical pricing/tax structures that result in bizarre behavior in order to get around at least some of that.

I am largely retired but in California I believe we had (have?) a sort of inventory tax or measure that took that into account (UDITPA?). Anyhow, when I moved here I asked about the reasons for the smog cloud over Highway 50 only in December. I was told it was trucks carting lots of inventory to warehouses in Nevada. And then back.

Same in Germany where I grew up. A/C wasn't needed. However, they used the same concept for heating, converting lots of electrical kWh into thermal energy and then storing that for the next day in a massive amount of dense bricks. Insulation only does so much and some of that heat leaked out overnight when it wasn't needed.

A consequence of the way that electrical power is billed. Would you pay for power and not use it?

Businesses don't care about how nonsensical a pricing scheme may be. If they can get a commitment to a given tariff over a significant bit of time, then they can make investment decisions with that pricing structure in place.

The unfortunate aspect is that there are no real guarantees for this. Tariffs can (and do) change. So, it becomes a gamble as to whether or not an investment decision will "make sense" in that changing environment.

Here, folks are learning that grid connected cogeneration leaves you at the mercy of the utility -- both in terms of how much you can deploy and what that will *cost* you, in the long run (you are using a resource that belongs to the utility so it has an argument about how it charges you for that usage).

It also forces you onto a ToU tariff so the extra load you have during those peak hours (e.g., your air conditioning unit) is billed at a higher rate than if you had the standard tariff.

If you don't use the utility as a storage medium, then only local building codes determine how much power you can generate and how you dispose of the excess (run outdoor lights during the daylight hours to boast of how much "extra" power you have available, to the disdain of your neighbors).

Yes. Because it only matters where the inventory is located at year's end. Prorate this for number of days in each locality and the behavior changes because the economics change.

A national vendor used to ship all of their surplus electronic equipment to us for disposal. Amusing to think they could ship things across the country (at least one semi-trailer every couple of weeks) for less money than they could save via the charitable tax deduction.

I buy VRLA batteries in lots of 10 because that's what a lot of *8* would cost. Even if I threw away two of them...

But, if the energy costs are negligible (or nil), who cares if you only net

"Flat tax", "excise tax", and "windfall tax" considered fair.

Since March-1, 2026 we have to. PG&E instituted a new flat fee of $24, even if your usage would be zero. Part of the continual growth in the fleecing of Californians.

Only until they do. I kept telling politicians how fast location decisions are being made in businesses. Some didn't believe me until they had their "Oh s..t!" moment. By then it was too late because such decisions are generally irreversible, or only at great cost to the government.

Out here even consumers are now partially decoupling. The start is usually a fridge/freezer circuit, then swamp cooling and so on. They run dedicated lines, install their own solar panels, batteries and inverters, and only charge that from utility power in rare situations where the solar doesn't deliver enough. Since older solar panels can be considered hazardous waste and then become next to impossible to dispose of, you can often acquire those for pennies on the dollar and then grossly overpanel.

Well, my last employer before becoming self-employed again reacted like many businesses do. They moved nearly all of production To Costa Rica. That fixes such issues.

Can't prorate because inventory logging takes place only once a year. It is a tedious and productivity-robbing process so politicians cannot force companies to do that monthly. Else their tax bases would erode even faster than it does today.

Yep.

We have had a "meter/connection" fee for gas and electric since forever. But, that buys you no gas/electricity -- it buys you the right to purchase it.

Some of the "demand" tariffs charged you based on your peak usage during a period (day), regardless of how much "actual" power you used. So, there is a big incentive to do load leveling.

If you have "no" usage for a significant portion of the day (e.g., a plant that only runs one or two shifts), then you are being billed for power during that period as if you had continued to use it at the peak rate.

So, the electricity is "free" -- if you can find a use for it.

Yes. But, to avoid the cost of on-site storage, you have to be able to identify (and isolate) a large enough load to make it viable. Solar landscape lighting doesn't cut it.

As nothing prevents you from powering that load from the utility WHEN utility power is available, you can use the utility when needed and NOT rely on it for storage. So, they have no voice in your deployment decisions and can only affect the price you pay as a regular consumer.

And, if you've already put your "toe" in, you can easily put your whole "foot" in if their "standard" pricing becomes too costly.

Until their economy tanks, etc. Many pharmaceutical houses moved production to Puerto Rico (taking advantage of tax breaks). I suspect none of them are still there, contending with unreliable power...

I know of many factories in New England that moved south (US) to take advantage of cheaper labor and "right to work" legislation. Then, discovered the workforce didn't have the skills necessary to continue making their products.

You don't have to canvas the entire store to know what SHOULD be in it. Additions arrive via documented processes and removals similarly. If the "net" isn't relatively accurate, then your business has far more serious issues to address! If you don't know what you have on hand, how can you commit to *selling* anything?

It buys you the connection, the availabity.

You can probably remove your electric wires and gas pipes and pay nothing.

John Larkin Highland Tech Glen Canyon Design Center Lunatic Fringe Electronics

But like I said fridges and freezers do. They are a big chunk in the electric bill of otherwise frugal hopuseholds.

When you do that here they charge you an effective $0.45/kWh. Motivation enough not to do that.

That gets expensive, fast, mainly because of high peak loads. But some people out here do that and go completely off grid.

Costa Rica is much more stable. Companies take a really long view on that sort of stuff.

That shows a lack of due diligence on their part. Assessing the skills of a work force isn't that difficult. I've seen similar but there the problem was that the workforce in the selected country did not comprehend English well enough. That almost qualifies for a Darwin award :-)

Sure but then there are the state rules and they want it all counted and certified.

Also, if they'd tax on inventory during the year that would entice companies to keep their stuff out of state. Or leave lock, stock and barrel. Which some did.

Yes, but not big enough to consume the sorts of "excess" power that you can have available. Think: air conditioning, etc.

They don't know the difference between a "solar enhanced" load and a traditional load. That's the point. You aren't relying on the utility to store your "excess", just *supplement* your needs.

It is common, here, in outlying areas. But, they have to be able to store their excess to get through periods of no power.

If, instead, you use local solar to power certain loads and utility power to carry those loads when your storage is exhausted, then you just look like a smaller user.

Everything is stable -- until it isn't.

If your industry doesn't have a presence in an area, then you don't have a reliable way of knowing what the local population can provide, in terms of quality of labor AND willingness to work in said industry.

Why no AI startups in Romney, West Virginia?

If a state wants to capture inventory costs, it can write whatever rules it wants to make that practical. If they put too high a bar, then companies look at the cost of *avoiding* those rules.

That just increases their cost to do business *in* the state.

Our sales tax approaches 10% (9.mumble). On a $50K vehicle, there is a huge incentive to avoid that tax. Yet, you don't see dealerships moving outside of the region where the taxes are imposed -- because that inconveniences their customers. Would you want to stake your business in an unincorporated area and have to worry about where you were going to get police, fire, insurance, etc.?

As long as your competitors are stuck in the same boat, there is no real incentive to play games.

The same applies to mail-order firms. If buying on-line allowed you to avoid local sales taxes, those retailers would have a price advantage.

Seems the most valuable use-case for "surplus electricity" would be "gasoline-producing machines".

LOL! It would be easier -- and safer -- to just buy an electric vehicle and dump charge into that.

But, that assumes your vehicle is always in need of charging...

There are a wide variety of devices, systems, and vehicles that depend on liquid fuel.

The grid is nowhere near capable of fulfilling that.

For example, in urban environments, there are not enough extension cables and not enough outlets, to trickle charge into various technologies of electrochemical batteries.

In rural environments, there is not enough range of the vehicles. Also the construction equipment is not anytime soon having a new fleet.

Mostly there aren't enough extension cords or outlets.

Maybe it would just be easier to pull the motor and put in a hybrid drive-train.

A true concept "super-capacitor" is the idea of a solid-state device, basically a monocrystalline block with a bunch of spikes in either side basically with a thin layer of thusly the dielectric material between them, quite a different concept than the usual idea of the electrochemical storage, that has at least near-instantaneous recharge and discharge, and arbitrarily long mean time between maintenance, error, failure, and replacement.

Anyways commercial offerings of gasoline producing machines that turn carbon dioxide and hydrogen monoxide into hydrocarbon fuels with electricity is already about the $7/gallon range.

It doesn't have to be. Do you, personally, care if your neighbor has power for his vehicle? The pizza delivery guy? etc.

If *your* needs are met (for every "your"), then that is sufficient.

I suspect I could easily live with an EV -- even with their limited range, lack of charging stations, charge times, etc. I don't drive much (~4000 miles/year) and rarely outside of a ~15 mile radius from home.

I know many people in a similar situation. And, others who drive their vehicle to work and let it sit, out in the sun, for 8+ hours while they are working.

I burn "petrol" because cars have always burned "petrol" in my life. I like being able to repair, modify, tweak, etc. them -- something that an EV would likely deprive me of.

In North Dakota, parking meters have electric outlets controlled by the time remaining on the meter. The outlet allows the driver to connect the block heater for his vehicle to a source of power so the engine oil doesn't become so thick that the vehicle won't turn over in the cold weather.

And, there is nothing that says a driver will deplete his battery getting *to* work just like I won't empty my tank getting to some place that isn't a fueling station.

A more practical solution may be to just avoid commuting unnecessarily? Do you *really* need to be *at* work to

Do *you* NEED to drive to a set of stores/vendors to purchase the supplies you need to live each week?

It's too easy to assume that cities and towns *have* to be laid out the way they are, simply because they HAVE been laid out, that way. How do other countries *somehow* manage to get by without the same energy dependence?

Not yet.

What's actually needed are induction chargers. Plugging in a plug erode the mating surfaces. Putting a receiving coil above a charging coil doesn't.

I recently upgraded my mobile phone to one that accepted inductive charging after the charging socket on it's predecessor had worn out and had to be replaced,

Not true.

Not a problem. there are already electric buses in service that get recharged by parking on top of an induction buried in the road under the last stop on their run.

But that does emit CO2 in operation, if not as much as a regular internal combustion engine.

Nobody who has ever worked on capacitor energy storage would take that seriously. The energy density on offer is utterly inadequate.

And they are hopelessly inefficient.

I depend on a prosperous, educated, informed middle class.

That's "ours".

So, say today a 25kW solar installation with an inverter to AC mains is about $15k. Then, imagine that 25kW x 24H makes 1 gallon gasoline from air and water, and that the "gasoline maker" has a cost of $5k. So, to recoup the cost, at five dollars a gallon, is 4,000 gallons, or about 12 years.

A gallon a day would be something and a milkman could go around and pick it up. Also it would be immune to supply shocks. Furthermore it wouldn't be dependent on geopolitics, and also it's carbon-neutral.

The importance of a strong middle class can not be understated, it is imperative to have a strong middle class.

Since mechanized inference can do most any kind of mental work, and is eager to do so, that though is for basically a brain-in-a-box tax or data center tax to offset what have been the uncommon gains of Moore's law and the embarrassment of computing resources, point being most anybody is going to be commuting to go to work.

Also it's just the usual matter of independence of movement, and also, for example, the inputs that build the roads and the bridges and the overpasses and the traffic lights and the parking meters and the tunnels and other usual accounts of "infrastructure".

Down the river there's a hydro dam, it was built in the 1970's. It paid for itself about thirty years ago. That's "infrastructure".

It's a simple fact that the pure concept super-capacitor is completely simple its principle of operation and basically like pouring a giant chip for power purposes. The precision of the distances of the electrodes across the dielectric makes it a bit different than smearing paste across a film and rolling it up and putting it in a tube.

How about the "thyrototron"? It's another example of what is a solid-state device, or at least insofar as it doesn't have any moving parts if you don't count plasma as not another state of matter, nice clean AC output from DC input, ideal and maximal efficiency.

I never heard of one of those before, yet it made a lot of sense as soon as it fit being "an ideal electrical component".