Re: How to measure C+stray to 0.01pf

Jul 07, 2016 10 Replies


>> >>


>> >>> >> > you see mainly at low frequencies, so if you make your measurements
>> >> > quickly, you won't see it.
>> >
>> >
>> >> > Since polystyrenes are strongly discouraged in new equipment design, I
>> >> > haven't bothered to look at how their DA is.
>> >
>> >> Why?
>> >
>> >On material properties, polystyrene and PTFE both look splendid: very low leakage.
>> >For mass production, though, styrene softens above about 100C. That's no good
>> >for a surface mount/reflow soldered component, so it has to be hand-assembled.
>> >
>> >PTFE and PPS go over 200C. Tin-silver-copper solder reflows at 217C.
>>
>> I told you older posts were more interesting. Unfortunately, Sally
>> doesn't live here any more. 2002....a vintage year.
>
>Looking back at the thread, I'm a bit surprised that nobody got onto roll-your-own AC (Blumlein) bridges.
>
>
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>
>has a section about small precison capacitors. Sadly, my copy (which I'd bought before 2002 ) is at home in Sydney, and I can't remember how much it has to say about measuring them.
>
>It would be hard to get a precision ratio transformer to work well at the sorts of frequencies you'd want to use to measure a 1pF capacitance, but the classic Blumlein centre-tapped transforner bridge would work fine for comparing small capacitors.
>
>In a national standards laboratory they'd be comparing the unknown capacitor with a Thompson-Lampard calculable capacitor
>
>
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>It's capacitance depends only on it's length, and typically they measure the length with a laser interferometer.
>
>The Thompson-Lampard theorem was published in 1956, when both the authors were working for the Australian Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation (CSIRO).

The old AAD meter (available at that time) exhibits about .01pF jitter. If all the OP wanted was .01pF resolution, then that might have been the quickest option.


Sort of takes the fun out of it, however.


RL

Supernews goes back to 2003, and Google way before that. archive.org also has a bunch of old SED, back to 2003ish.

Where's the pre-1991 stuff?

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net

Sort of wondering where you're getting the headers from 2002. The only archives I'm currently aware of go back only to 2014 or Pre-1991.

RL

Sorry, I thought I'd corrected that to 2004.

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Have trouble navigating archive.org for anything looking like a thread-date display. They provide Pre 1991 from the wiseman archive

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Never did sign into Google. Probably won't. Is this where Whit3rd is reading old threads?

RL

Probably.

Cheers

Phil Hobbs

Dr Philip C D Hobbs Principal Consultant ElectroOptical Innovations LLC Optics, Electro-optics, Photonics, Analog Electronics 160 North State Road #203 Briarcliff Manor NY 10510 hobbs at electrooptical dot net http://electrooptical.net

Sally had designed her own capacitance meter, and really wanted advice on w hy it wasn't working well. Since she didn't post any details of the circuit , and was worrying about dielectric absorbtion in a polystyrene capacitor, it wasn't the kind of thread that was going to go anywhere useful.

Bill Sloman, Sydney

Yes, I got the thread with a search on Google Groups... not recalling the circumstances next morning, posted a reply. Noticed the date, tried to un-post, but maybe that's only a Google thing...

The 'wiseman' artchive sounds nifty, gotta try that...

Not user friendly. Double-compressed in varying file organization, with many anomalies in data within and without individual archives - every post an individual entity, unsortable by filename as to date or subject.

It would be real project to reorganize the (~html) contents, as any automation has to negotiate the anomalies.

RL

I went looking for Win's thread on 0.02ff.. found this,

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George H.

I've used these before, especially the 2700A:

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Hard to argue with the guys NIST buys secondary standards from...

For those looking for a more practical device...

For fun and giggles, you might like to toy around with FDC1004 or ADC7745/ADC7746

The FDC dev kit is a lot for fun for 49.95/

Steve

It doesn't help that the original poster was looking for help with measurement to .001pF, not 0.01pF.

RL

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