OT: ABS plastic repair for electronics enclosure

Try this experiment. Take two black ABS plastic fittings (not PVC or CPVC) and try to glue the OUTSIDE surfaces together. ABS is usually used for drain pipes, PVC for electrical, and CPVC for water. Two couplings will demonstrate the problem rather nicely. Because concentric pipe connections have a rather large common surface area, the glue does not need to be very strong, gap filling, or tolerant of minor deflections. The result is that such a small surface external glue connection will easily crack, flake, or crumble. If the two cylindrical surfaces are not perfectly straight and parallel, the glue filled gap will certainly crack. (Note that ABS does not require a primer).

Good idea. I had that idea once and used a grinding wheel to produce PVC (not ABS) powder. I ended up melting the PVC and had to resurface the grinding wheel. I suppose a slower and rougher grinding wheel would have done a better job. These daze, if I need filler, I use various powdered metals "borrowed" from the local powdered metal fabrication shop.

Yep. That's roughly what my little experiment demonstrates. There's more to making a strong glue joint than just the glue. Most of the plastic glues are acrylic or some other plastic dissolved in a solvent (usually heptane). When the solvent evaporates, the acrylic remains behind to make the connection. If there's no adhesion between the acrylic and the ABS, it's not going to work. However, if the solvent softens the surface of the ABS slightly, the acrylic mixes with the ABS along the glue line, and the joint is much stronger. The plastic epoxy that I recommended seems to use these methods, with the added bonus of a glue that's stronger than acrylic. Try gluing the same two ABS fitting together with this stuff and note the difference in strength.

I beg to differ. Hot glue is rather brittle, does not stick to smooth surfaces, and will fall apart on a hot day. There's plenty of places where I will use the stuff, but not for anything I want to be permanent.

One trick I use for plastic repair is plastic welding. It uses exactly the same techniques as oxy-acetylene gas welding, except that can be done with a cheap propane torch or hot air source. Of course, it works at much lower temperatures. I melt the plastic with the torch flame and add filler in the form of a plastic rod. I use my SMD desoldering station (Saike 852D+) with a very small orifice tip. Keep the air flow low, so that the hot air doesn't blow the plastic away from the weld area. Google for "hot air plastic welding". Lots of other products and YouTube videos.

However, hot air plastic welding does take some practice. One of my early mistakes was trying to weld the plastic mounting studs back onto the plastic keyboard bezel on a Toshiba laptop. I used too much heat resulting in a very visible melt zone on the front panel. To prevent a repetition of this mistake, I now use a wet sponge on the opposite side of the weld area. When I hear the water sizzle, I stop.

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Reply to
Jeff Liebermann
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Sorry... that should be a butane torch, not propane. There are plenty of such butane torches on eBay, Amazon, and other sites. The trick is finding one that doesn't get too hot or has too large a flame. The one I found literallyl fell apart after about the 4th weld. Hot air plastic welding is easier.

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Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558
Reply to
Jeff Liebermann

Thanks for the suggestions, everyone. As a first try for an expedient repair, I'll see if the JB Weld works out.

Reply to
bitrex
[...]

I remember that as well, but I thought it was for Gorilla Glue?

Reply to
JW

No, in just about any hardware or auto parts store, you could see a "toy" made of something epoxied to a golf ball. Usually it was JBWeld.

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Les Cargill
Reply to
Les Cargill

Isn't gorilla glue rather recent? My childhood was in the 60's. (born in '58) I was trying to find a picture on the web.... no luck.

George H.

Reply to
George Herold

Gorilla Glue first appeared in the USA around 1998. It's owned by the Ragland family. I couldn't find much on the company history, but this should help:

Gorilla Glue was one of the first urethane adhesives. The problem is that it works best on smooth parallel surfaces. Any gaps filled with glue are full of gas bubbles and are very weak.

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Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558
Reply to
Jeff Liebermann

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Reply to
John Fields

Jb weld and gorilla glue can be very brittle. I think gorilla glue can be stronger if water is not added. Make a coin with JB weld and bend it.

Greg

Reply to
gregz

When you wet it, like wood pieces, its nothing but bubbles.

Greg

Reply to
gregz

What I remember from the '60's is a two part expoxy called PV-7. I think it's still around. Looks very much like JB Weld, but I don't think they put iron in the resin. They had a big piece of wood glued to a pop bottle, stuck on there pretty good. It was packaged in two plastic 35mm film cans. Tom

Reply to
hifi-tek

Lost of good info quickly from a search engine; try:

ABS plastic adhesive

Look up the data sheet and MSDS for your candidate adhesives. I would probably use a two step process, one material for gluing the parts back together and a different one for the fill-in.

?-)

Reply to
josephkk

base,

Definitely. Both Acetone and MEK have bad fumes problems.

?-)

Reply to
josephkk

Krazy glue has never given me strong joints in ABS. I use some kind of solvent weld, like the brush-on plastic model glue sold by hobby shops, lacquer thinner, or throttle body/carburetor spray). Small bits of ABS plastic fills gaps and can be molded into the gaps with solvent.

Reply to
Bob Boblaw

Here's a Dow Corning urethane glue that was descrubed in Popular Science, Jan

1975, p. 11.:

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My father had a tube of it with a steel eye screw instead of a cap on the nozzle. The screw couldn't be loosened.

Reply to
Bob Boblaw

Acetone?

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Reply to
Fred Abse

1975, p. 11.:

nozzle. The screw couldn't be loosened.

I stand corrected. However, the description in the above URL proclaims "But you'll like this new glue for clear, strong, waterproof, weatherproof, and flexible bonds to most materials". The Gorilla Glue incantation is not clear, but dries milky white. It's anything but flexible and is very brittle. On anything other than a thin glue line, it's not very strong. However, it is waterproof and presumably weatherproof (UV proof?). My guess(tm) is that Gorilla Glue and the Dow Corning urethane glue are very different formulations.

Also, I just remembered we were using urethane conformal coatings on PCB's in the 1970's. It was rather flexible and could easily have been sold as a glue since getting it off the board required some messy solvents.

Incidentally, I've also done the screw eye cap trick to seal a tube of glue, with similar results. Also, getting the caps interchanged between two part epoxy containers.

--
Jeff Liebermann     jeffl@cruzio.com 
150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com 
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com 
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558
Reply to
Jeff Liebermann

My (dried out :-) can of Oakey ABS cement (used here for lawn "irrigation" piping) says the solvent is MEK. ...Jim Thompson

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Reply to
Jim Thompson

I use this kind:

formatting link

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Regards, Joerg 

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Reply to
Joerg

se,

It probably will.

For future reference, balky plastic joints usually succumb to Plastruct cements:

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Usually available at hobby stores.

Oh, the plastic bits are good for cabinet prototyping, too.

Mark L. Fergerson

Reply to
alien8752

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