Elektor PCB Router

use.

ektor

The specifications look impressive but at $4,900.00 how many companies are there that can justify buying one?

Howard

You find these machines mostly at schools and companies that do RF stuff. Usually they are collecting dust because they are not very easy to operate and keep operational. A proper etching kit is much easier and faster.

--
Failure does not prove something is impossible, failure simply
indicates you are not using the right tools...
nico@nctdevpuntnl (punt=.)
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Whereas one of the free PCB CAD authors out there just had a new release recently.

Without solder mask, plated pads (and vias!), and silkscreening to find one's way around a crowded board, it certainly doesn't seem like an unrelieved blessing. Post-processing with a chemical deposition of tin (after a good scrubbing, of course, to remove any oxide layer) and then something like Press'n'Peel Blue to add legends would help but that also adds another layer of labor hours.

Still, it's not a heart-stopping price and I'd be surprised if there weren't application domains where it's a good fit.

--
Rich Webb     Norfolk, VA

I made from an existing X,Y drafting power driven table a similar set up how ever, I put a needle jet pump assembly where the PIN normally goes that sprays blue dye ink, the same used in machine shop work. It has a current sensor so that I can tell when the ink has hit the surface and retract the pump. the pump is a worm driven type made from a very small drill bit (#65 if I remember) The jet port is made with a EDM machine my friend has for a very small stream. The movements on the table are very small and accurate.. It's not the fastest thing in the world but it works very nicely and I can do double sided boards via an alignment process when I flip the board over.

Software I write to drive the table and Z axis from a PC with a BMP images scaled to proper size..

When done, drop it in the etching tank with the guides.

The table I got from a HAM swap meet and the rest I hacked out between me and the use of my friends shop..

These days, I tend to use toner transfer for simple one time things.

Jamie.

We have a machine something like this. It's such a PITA to use that it's cheaper, overall, to order prototype boards. They come with solder mask and all (well, once the new boss is shown that saving $20 really costs many hundreds).

For any U.S. company that can afford to keep full-time engineers around, $4,900 should not be that big of a deal.

Their main advantage is that you can have a board minutes after finishing your layout, and sometimes not having to wait the week or so that you typically have to with the inexpensive board houses can make it worthwhile. Another good use is if you need less common board stock (e.g., low-loss or thin stock -- both common for RF designs); the inexpensive board houses usually won't provide those under standard pricing.

On the other hand, if you can wait a 3-7 days, and if a bog-standard 2- or

4-layer .062" board will work for you, the quality of the commercial board houses is rather better than what these machines produce and typically cheaper to boot!

Even for hobbyists (were your time is "free"), you have to have cut a *lot* of boards to break even. Granted, for hobbyists it might just be the "coolness" factor and they're not looking at it as an investment in the first place. (It's not like those guys spending thousands of dollars on fancy model railroads typically ever make any money off of them... And guys who restore old cars... great way to spend a *lot* of money fast! :-) )

---Joel

There are a lot of toys in that price range. Pretty soon it adds up to real money. I just had a demo of a scope. Only $13,500. Such a deal! It's not my money (and it most likely won't get spent).

Without a solder mask, multiple planes, and plated through holes, you're limited to some pretty simple boards. Perhaps RF types can make use of them but I haven't found them very useful. They're too fragile for test fixtures, as well.

A *lot* cheaper, if you account for all of the time spent.

Hobbies don't have to be justified. Don't even try. ;-)

Agreed; "bang for the buck" certainly matters. Those $1600 thermal imagers strike me as a very good value for the money these days, yet other than Larkin's place I don't know of any small electronics companies that have them.

We have some shipping products that use a few so-called "cut" boards... mostly things like small "patch" boards containing, e.g., an RF splitter and perhaps some termination resistors and connectors, also some LED indicator boards (LEDs, resistors, and connector), and so on. I'm not convinced this is preferable nor cheaper than getting commercially made boards, but, well, it gives the production guys another thing to do, I suppose, and the boss approves. :-)

Yeah...

I remember someone noting that the original Macintosh's hardware designer, Jef Raskin, seemed to have a knack for turning all of his hobbies into money-making ventures, though... amazing!

---Joel

We have one, but I'm quite sure it wasn't anywhere near $1600. it was more likely from Harbor Freight.

So do we. It scared the crap out of me when they told me.

It tends to ruin the hobby. It's one reason I don't do electronics at home.

I mean the 2D ones, e.g.,

-- AFAIK that's the least expensive one available (and it really is low-end specs --

64x64 array or so); I think John's is a rather more expensive model.

---Joel