Comparison table for capacitance per um^2 for IC processes?

Jun 28, 2013 38 Replies

On this side of the pond, it's generally labeled "knock".

We have a place here called "The Pork Shop" with all kinds of cardiac-straining goodies. ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Casually including any kind of meat in a shipment to the US would be a good way to make sure it never, ever arrives, so definitely "wurst case".

Best regards, Spehro Pefhany

"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

I brought a couple of QUARTS of Russian Caviar thru Dallas customs (AA from Frankfurt) one time with nary a quibble... they didn't even value it for duties ;-) ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Just like they call a cell phone a "Handy" on the other side of the pond.

Tonight we will have tri-tip and "brats", grilled over charcoal. My wife scoped out a sale, 16.6lbs Kingsford charcoal for $5 a bag. So we loaded up. For that money I can't even make my own charcoal.

This is our place:

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Kasseler and Leberkaes are also most excellent there, they make everything themselves.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

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...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Nice. But tell them it's spelled "Bierwurst", even in Arizona.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Where are you seeing that? The only "wurst" I see is "bratwurst". ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Price list -> cold cuts -> 3rd from bottom.

I wonder what a Kung Fu Bologna is. One that burns twice?

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Looks like it won't be this easy. After cleaning up line breaks LTSpice didn't like the schematic syntax.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

It's not a schematic, it's a subcircuit definition ;-) ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Yes, I know, but LTSpice treats it the same way. Something about the syntax it doesn't like. Unfortunately is is not very forthcoming when it issues error warning boxes.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

It needs to be put in a library and a matching symbol created for LTspice to recognize it... or... hand edit a netlist (.cir) and add this to it.

Also LTspice probably doesn't recognize "N33E2R", a model name... pick something it does, or add the XFAB libraries to LTspice. ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

I just noticed something... 0.2mm x 1mm = 200Kum^2

At 2.5fF/um^2, that gives you 500pF total MAX, if ALL the chip is capacitance and 0.2mm isn't wide enough for two conventionally-sized pads and some scribe grid allowance.

Joerg, Are you having another one of your wet dreams ?:-} ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

You have just described why I posted my question. I'd like to know if there is a way out of this pickle.

Looks like we may need more pads after all, maybe four in total. But thou need not fret because it's been done before:

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Tons of pads, 15um*17um smallest pad, 75um pitch.

No, just another one of those projects. One order of "Can't be done" and one order of "Impossible"? Comin' right up, Sir. The other IC at Endosonics (see link above, 0.4mm by 2.5mm, each having 13 channels with full receive and transmit) was also causing reactions like "You guys must be out of your minds". In full production since ninteen-sumpthin. We had to build the flip-chip bonder (and later two more) ourselves because all except one company chickened out.

There are multi-layer methods but that gets expensive and you can't partcipate in shuttle runs, MPW and all that.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

And the capacitance you need? ...Jim Thompson

| James E.Thompson | mens | | Analog Innovations | et | | Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus | | San Tan Valley, AZ 85142 Skype: Contacts Only | | | Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat | | E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 | I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.

Right now I am at 350pF for the one that goes to GND and 150pF for the poly-poly. Looking at ways to reduce that some more but it's already 89F in the office. Very possibly I won't turn on the computer after church but dive into the pool :-)

Anyhow, reducing the caps comes with other penalties unless I can get the whole circuit including the 400MHz TX to live on much less than 1mW.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

those.

I haven't had good Landjeager since i brought some back from Alpine Village in Torrance. I wish to add my own consumption to production load. So where do i go?

?-)

Here:

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They also have most excellent Leberkaes and Kassler if you are into that (we are, big time). If you buy the Leberkaes make sure to thaw it completely before baking.

Regards, Joerg http://www.analogconsultants.com/

Yum, Spar's sausage in Buffalo has been making a splash lately. (Maybe like the beer renaissance that happened in the US a few decades ago.)

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I've only tried a few of them. George H.

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